classic motorcycle forum
Motorcycle Discussions => British Bikes => Topic started by: johnnyboy-wonder57 on October 12, 2012, 09:56:28 PM
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Hi,
I have been re-reading Hopwood's book, Whatever Happened....but in looking things up on the net, I found this Roland Pike's memoirs, apparently the chapters missing had been already published in a book, apart from Chapter 25, these memoirs may get to the heart of the problem of our industries demise, in a more direct way than the former text. They can be accessed through http://www.beezanet.com/daytona/roland_pike.htm (http://www.beezanet.com/daytona/roland_pike.htm)
I have just come back from Lancashire & seen an old industrial area of MOD land the old ROF @ Euxton, being ruthlessly developed; it was 7-8 square miles of land, both my Father's parents worked there & his brother, they reckon its going to be the biggest residential area in Western Europe, Buckshaw Park or something, nothing seems left of this once vast industrial complex. Of interest, I noticed that Bloor homes, ( of Triumph fame), were amongst the developers.
Industrial Lancashire has been flattened & has sprouted 1000s of toy-town houses for seemingly 1000s of toy-town people, what a mess. I never thought as I cycled to a bomb crater in the middle of the fields as a boy, that this apocalyptic vision would meet me 45 years later. Sadly I feel very little connection to any of the new County strategy for |Lancashire & hope that my adopted County of Kent doesn't go on the same Orwellian journey, with also 20mph speed restrictions blighting every possible urban area of residential development,http://www.20splentyforus.org.uk/ (http://www.20splentyforus.org.uk/).
I read somewhere that 120,000 people lost their jobs when BSA closed, BAE anyone, who said pardon the man & bring back Guy Fawkes?
JBW
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As one era ends, another begins. ?
If you look back at industrial history all through time, the goat and horse and donkey replaced the labour of mans back, the wheel usurped them all, the railway upheaved the lot of them, the sail ship was replaced by steam and the propellor, gave way to fuel oil, then wings beat the lot of them, and the jet replaced the propellor. etc etc etc
Change begats change.
Thus goes the cycle of rebirth and rebirth and rebirth.
Perhaps all those old Indian mystics knew something. ?
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Ironic, I moved out of Kent,[born and bred] because they've mucked up Kent as I knew it; when I go back there I get near to tears to see what happened to it.
As for the industrial heritage gone we have only ourselves to blame, unions [ I am still a union member] with ever unrealistic demands for higher wages, people who demand ever cheaper goods, instead of supporting the home industry, in order to have disposable income to spend on foreign "status" cars; Crooked politicians ever eager to go along with consumer demand in order to promote a false feel good factor for their own ends....... voter apathy, voters ever eager to vote like sheep, mass immigration which was encouraged to undermine the UK worker.
Dangerous subject to post on, and its still going on.
Too late change now we have population of sheeple.
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Population pressure may have something to do with it too ?
Gotta house all those surplus folks somewhere.
Speaking of sheep, maybe this sums it up = global phenomenom ?
http://media.nzherald.co.nz/webcontent/image/gif/201241/65lzh35c.gif
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I was born 10 miles from Sheffield in the heartland of the South Yorkshire coal field, when I grew up 90% of people either went "down the pit" or worked in Sheffield at the Steel works. Since the 80's all this has gone... I left too to live and work abroad and returned to York a few years later and stayed there for 15 years. In the 90's I returned home to the village where I was brought up and resettled here.
The environment had changed dramatically, tree trunks, sparrows and starlings were no longer black but had some colour and the near by river Dearne was no longer a highly toxic soup that put you in hospital if you fell in, but supported a good head of fish. The environment has continued to improve and is really good now. However the malaise has shifted from our surroundings to the community.
The main problem being that the jobs for hundreds of thousands of people were ended in a ten year period and the vacuum has not been filled by other jobs except for a few 'Mickey Mouse' companies, as I've heard them called, offering basic minimum wage jobs. There are 'third generation unemployed' and have the mind set that if it was good enough for Grandad and Dad to be on the dole it's good enough for me. Now the area has plunged into a social tail spin of drugs and criminality of various kinds. We have been fortunate in that we have not had the influx of masses from the sub-continent or indeed more lately from eastern europe to compound our problems and I must say it's all of our own indigenous making!
Most people around these parts blame Maggie and will no doubt party on the old lass's demise. They hate and distrust the police (hardly suprising after the events of the Miners strike and now Hillsborough we officially find out) so much so that I would say 75% of crime is unreported. Many people are making do with benefits and other illicit occupations. The area is getting very run down and shops and pubs have closed in their droves. We too have thousands of acres... oh sorry hectares of brown field sites and some like you say in Lancashire are being filled up with "little boxes on the hillside".
I can't offer up a remedy, I wish I could, but I know that like most others who are getting a little long in the tooth, that if this is progress, things certainly aint what they used to be!
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"mass immigration which was encouraged to undermine the UK worker" nail and head , birmingham is now the first city in the uk to have a majority immigrant population , well done , "the war will be won thro the womb of woman " and he was right , ps the koran is available FREE to any NONE muslims down here .
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That was Slough, many years ago, but I take your point.
Fair point about undermining the indigenous workers too. I never could understand the unions' viewpoint that it was a "Good Thing" to encourage immigration in the 1940s and 50s as even then there were enough "workers" for the available jobs. The old fallacy beloved by the liberals and encouraged by the Right was that "but the immigrants do the jobs the English won't do" which was all bollix on so many levels and still apparently exists today in some quarters.
Even on the BBC this week there was a piece on young Spaniards coming here to find work, and the tone was "How lucky we are to get these hard-working educated men" when they should have really been saying "so how many more poor-English speaking waiters do we need sucking up benefits etc". The good old liberal elite have much to answer for.... >:(
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If the Islamic birth rate of those already here increases at the same percentage year by year as it has already by 2040 this country will be 80% muslim.
The establishment have taken away our guns; yet there are certain sections of the population walking about with all kinds of weapons yet the yumman rights brigade have given them apparently irrevocable British citizenship so they cannot be got rid of.
We have no means of defence; the same crime committed by a white English man merits a more punitive judicial punishment that the same crime committed by a cultural enricher. I have strong views on who why what is behind it all, not for here really, but its time we woke up.
I'm glad I'll not be around to see the debacle.
I hope we are not on the way to upset the mods here.
I'll state right here and now, I am a proud white English nationalist.
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I always thought this site was underused, 4 topics a week, but the topic that generates most discussion is not about motorcycles at all!
It`s the same when I talk to people in the street or at shows, everywhere everybody is on about immigrants. Lancashire needs this new town for a white ghetto for people driven from their hometowns of Blackburn, Burnley, Nelson, Accrington, Bolton etc. Did you like that?
Some of my best friends bikes are black.
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Yes I find its the same everywhere but people are terrified of speaking their minds in case the PC brigade scream Raciss! at them.
And its not all about skin colour either its about attitude, ethics and morality.
Th PC lot are correct in one thing, this country has always given refuge to the refugees of the world, difference is this time we have allowed into our country a set of people whose avowed intention is to dominate us.They have no intention of adopting our culture of way of life.
That is the difference between other waves of immigration and this one.
They are waging economic and womb warfare.
We have rolled over and are too cowed to do something about it, our political leaders are nearly all of recent foreign ancestry and have their own agendas.
We need to speak out loudly and often, or your granddaughters will be wearing hijab.
and to keep it motorcycle related I have no wish to see the bikes I have preserved from our industrial heritage being broken up in 50 years time in order to use the wheels for a donkey cart.
Anyone who wants some strong stuff to read and to read about the sort of story that is kept out of the media is welcome to PM me for a list.
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Mr Wink misses the point. It's not about "how black" someone is but how can "we" keep absorbing the waifs and strays of the world? We don't need any more Pakistani doctors or waiters, Polish cooks and plumbers, (who incidentally are generally rubbish at it) or Lebanese taxi drivers. We especially don't need them when our own semi-literate under-class can't get any sort of meaningful work and need to be paid to sit at home watching their mates on Jeremy Kyle....
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We don't need any more criminals of any kind, regrettably the statistics we are not shown, rather than the ones we are, suggest that proportionally most of our criminals are not home grown.
Its all on the net, not internet woffle but from Govt sources.
check out the relative statistics for rape, murder, violence, financial fraud its very very scary.
However has the NUJ and the BBC control the info we see media these things are not shown.
There is a U tube video of a Black woman completely losing the plot on public transport; ranting against white people, abusive, racist threatening; U tube are continually removing it as fast as it is re posted on there, despite hundreds of people reporting it to the police no action has been taken against that woman; meanwhile for a similar rant just as, or even less bad, a white woman is now doing time. The video of that woman is still there after a year or more.
Now is the time to start speaking out and standing up to be counted. Make the establishment listen for once.
It'll be like the Balkans on this island in a few decades, unfortunately we have nowhere to run to.
After the next round of proposed Army cuts there are right now illegals in this country than there will be soldiers in the Army.
A whole army of people who hate us, our way of life, our culture, our history, every thing we stand for just waiting their opportunity.
If Hitler had had the same forces living here amongst us in 1939 history would have been a lot different.
Welcome to the gestating state of North Pakistan., previously known as Great Britain courtesy of Blair, Thatcher, Brown, Cameron, and all the rest of their cohorts.
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wait till the Turkish arrive , very soon , they are muslim but even the muslims here already dont want them , the conflict about to kick off will bring there arrival forwards , anyone whos been to Turkey will have seen what a poor poulation it has , to them UK is heaven
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Seems to me that there is scheming afoot for the Saudi generated troubles in Syria to spill over into Turkey, that way NATO ie us and the US, will get the excuse they are trying to find to go into Syria>>>Iran?
Speak up speak out, stand up to be counted and hang the consequences, the only way. Don't be smothered by the PC brigade.
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Guys,
The post was about the seemingly gleeful de-industrialisation of one of the industrial heartlands of the UK & the unstinting one- dimensional Political & Social solution of building 1000s of "Micky-mouse" homes in their place..... which also just tied in with the fact that on my visit, to Central Lancashire I got back from my Father, a book I had previously lent him... Bert Hopwood's "Whatever Happened to the BMI.".. about the Motorcycle Industry & Birmingham/Coventry/Woolwich e.t.c for a re-read.
John Bloor, (the owner of Triumph), is developing houses there @Euxton/Leyland/ Buckshaw, as he previously did on numerous sites elsewhere & famously @ Meriden. When he bought the old Triumph factory. The story goes, he got the Manufacturing Rights to the Triumph name on purchasing the site & whether he loved motorcycles or not, I do not know, but probably for commercial reasons he started manufacturing new Triumph motorcycles in 1991& in so far as I can assess a lot of enthusiasts are grateful on this account. He just happens to be one of the speculators/developers @ present on the site.
The World has changed, of that there is no doubt, but the people responsible for most of the major upsets in this part of the World/Europe, have I believe in the main, had the same coloured face as I have, through introducing misguided policies & short-term solutions to the problems we are facing.
If you look behind the policies of many industries the drive perhaps through stiff competition & then later on Globalisation, has been to de-skill the workforce, from Henry Ford onwards.. thus/therefore limiting the potential earnings people could receive in re-numeration. If you then apply this to the less than thoughtful destruction of our Industrial manufacturing sector in the past, of which other factors too were partially to blame, poor Management, Consultancy Syndrome, radicalised Unions, poor under-capitalised plant, inflation, Investor/Share-holder returns, spiralling land values, Speculators greed, Computerisation e.t.c. you are left with an employment model that inevitably leads to an increase in many non-essential posts in mid-tier level, the downsizing of productive employees & a reduced wage structure for many as their tasks are inevitably semi-skilled & low skilled operations.
Probably it could have been different for the UK, if sufficient revenue from taxes & North Sea oil had been ear-marked for training & bringing forward a technical revolution in manufacturing that started to happen in the late 80s & 90s on a greater scale elsewhere.
Politicians in the main, strive to maintain the Status Quo, when the felt that the Financial Sector could foot the Nations bill, it was unbridled & other sectors were forgotten or left to the mercy of Financial policies of, the way to go was whatever gave the greatest numerical return to the few involved. Money & power now gravitates to a smaller & smaller section of society, surely this is the core problem of the Nation/World?
Even my Schoolboy lessons in Economics stated that you needed to make goods & export products to maintain a good balance of payments, no Eton or Harrow involved here!
Lastly, having worked in Turkey 4 years ago & being left stranded by an airline, I made my way back to Blighty by train, coach & foot having only a moderate amount of £s in my back pocket.
In Frankfurt being short of the required full fee to get train to Cologne, in the rain, I approached a group of Muslim taxi drivers & asked if anyone wanted to buy my leather jacket for the Euro equivalent of £18, they retired and then asked me why I needed the money, so I told them, 5 minutes later, their leader went down the Taxi rank & came back with more than I required & told me that it was not right for a man to sell his jacket in such bad weather & to take the money with their best wishes to continue my journey! I am eternally grateful to them & continued to Cologne where my Employers could wired some money to me.
No white faces helped me that day, things may be difficult in relationships between different groups, but in my experience, race is only a barrier when you make it so & the collective situation is often very different on individual level.
I realised a long time ago on this site that if I had "haved" a foreign sounding name I probably wouldn't have got any or many replies.
I was hoping for some comments on the demise of our much beloved dysfunctional industry..perhaps from someone who worked there or some long-term good solutions to our Industrial decline!
JBW
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I thought you had had some answers? what applied to the demise of all our industry applied to the motorcycle industry, and there is little point in us amateurs discussing yesterdays mistakes.
That is if you believe its a "mistake" I worked in the motorcycle industry right at the very end, and its rapidly became my belief, which was shared among the remaining workforce, that that asset stripper Denis Poore for one, had the intention to set out to destroy what was left of it.
Our industry, all of it, has been exported to, for want of a better word, punish the British worker, and for short term profit for vested interests; hence even our basic utilities are foreign owned.
Equally responsible were the Unions, who probably helped to put as many workers out of work as the vested interests, riddled with communists or confused versions of it, there were intent on confrontation and happy to cut off their noses to spite their faces.
The working man was stuffed, as the closed shop was a tyrant.
Back in the 1960s I once had to go on strike for a day, in a south London factory, in support of a dispute in another engineering concern way up north; all that achieved was the loss of a days wages. Then I saw the light.
I did make the point right at the start that my views had nothing to do with skin colour, but it should now be obvious that it is becoming the dominant worry in this country is immigration, from anywhere.
Like it or not it, its Islam that's perceived as the threat. Rightly so in my opinion
A brown face does not make a Muslim.
One police force alone is arresting 33 immigrant criminals every day, mostly from East Europe. A brown face does not make a Muslim.
Whether they are all good or all bad it makes no difference this country is sleep walking into a disaster quite soon.
and as stated above everything these days seems to come back to immigration and the worry it is causing, the flight from inner cities etc
seemingly gleeful de-industrialisation of one of the industrial heartlands of the UK & the unstinting one- dimensional Political & Social solution of building 1000s of "Micky-mouse" homes
The two are irrevocably connected, what would you do with the site? build factories that make stuff we cannot sell? using skills we no longer have or train in? the houses are being built because of the increase in population which is out of hand and its out of hand WHY?
Hopwoods book seems to pop up on various forums from time to time, prompting debate about things past, have you not thrown bait upon the waters and caught a bigger fish than you expected?
Motor cyclists are heartily disliked by the establishment for the reason that riding motorcycles shows an independent turn of mind, and worse still a desire to be an " Individual" the biggest crime one can commit in this country today.
Its a bugger of a subject this, and bound to cause upset to someone.
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I came from a working class family and was brought up on a council estate a few miles north of Nottingham,my father was a forman for a famous aero engine company and a stout Labour party supporter as was 'mum' can you imagine the reaction i got when i told them that at the next election that i intended to vote Tory!Why said mum,you will regret it said dad,the fact is dad, i dont know who the labour party really stand for i said,they seem to want to support anyone who wants to go on strike and cause industrial chaos, but they will stand up for you when you need them he informed me and the tory will always stand up for the rich and industrialist,i guess the real point to me writing this is that both views are true! Mr Blair and Brown have allowed hundreds of thousands of immigrants into the country to generate a pool of social underclass (because most will struggle for a generation) thus looking after future votes,and guess what! the Tory party are now bringing bills into parliment to try and restrict immigration thus ensuring their future vote pool,We have all been shafted by self serving MP's and councilers.The problem is we are the ones to blame for allowing this to happen.The two party system we have got will always look after themselves after all they need a job too!
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I came from a working class family and was brought up on a council estate
Me too. and proud of it. Still in retirement a union member as well.
I too have had good experiences with 'immigrants' My daughters life was saved by the quick diagnosis and instant action of a black doctor; I too have had needed assistance from black guy after an accident in France, I have sub-let a flat to a girl from Cameroon, her and her families opinions on West Indians for instance cannot be repeated here.
That is not the point.
The point is waves after wave of unrestricted, let em all in immigration which is causing grave disquiet in this country.
The immigrants themselves are not to blame for what happened to this countries industry, we are, in that we all swallowed the lies and bullshit spouted by successive politicians with their own agenda.
It is becoming ever more transparent, these other agendas but as we have bred a generation of sheeple and thicko chavs it is ever harder to convince them that it is so.
Even if we started to regenerate our industry tomorrow where are the skilled men? working in B&Q,? or had enough, or retired or just too cynical. We need to teach kids in school the joys of working with their hands, the joy of making something, Instead schools are closing engineering or carpentry workshops because of "health and safety"
My own school which had well equipped carpentry and metal work shops is now a "Centre of Excellence for Performing Arts" in other words its teaching the hooded 2nd generation rubbish that haunts the streets at night to play the drums and dance.
Plumstead my roots, where my family had market stalls for generations is derelict crap hole run by Somali gangstas; gone is the Arsenal, Siemans , the shipyards and all the other industries, no one would want to work there even if those factories survived its too bloody dangerous.
Its all very well to wring ones hands over the issue but the causes and effects are there to be seen.
We were warned.
The bottom line is that you should never have bought that Japanese bike or TV, the German car, the Chinese tat of all kinds that's stuffed all our industry, not while the same thing could have been bought here, but you all wanted it cheap cheap cheap.
The most powerful political force in this country is the consumer, if only they'd realise it. If you don't buy foreign goods, the multi nationals profits will suffer and they'll look to make goods here if the demand grows.
Does no one feel ashamed that we import chicken from Thailand and south America to sell cheap chicken to mostly immigrants? or throwaway motorcycles from China, a potential enemy?
We had quite adequate commuter motorcycles or Mopeds made in France [yes I know that's outside UK as well] the Motobecane; cheap reliable easy to maintain, 200mpg, that was exterminated by the EU on "green" grounds. and we used to make them here under licence.
How many realise that a huge percentage of Germanys wealth is solely because its a clearing house, import centre for Chinese made goods? They are the middle men of the EU, nearly all out imports from the Far east come into the EU via Germany.
Its all there to see, how why when who.
Its a gods gift to ranters this thread.
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A friend of mine was once discussing the burial of a colleague & the Funeral arrangements & another man chipped in, to which he said, "why are you expressing an opinion, you have made it clear for the last twenty years that you are an Atheist, so why should it bother you, after all, when you die, surely just a hole in the ground will be good enough for you"!
You may think that this has nothing to do with the thread I initially posted & yet it is the same situation under a different guise, for the content in some of the posts have nothing to do with the core material I intended the post to be about except by the most tenuous links, to express vested points of view on the nature of immigration & the racial make-up of our islands.
Neither of which has primarily anything to do with BSA's etal industrial demise. I'm not that certain either that house building also can be attributed solely to the above either, surely our traditional 2 storey houses should be built in a more cost effective 3 or 4 storey form, saving land & giving families more living space. However, the artificial drive to build, connected to our domestic housing crisis is again linked more to a lack of previous Financial controls in Bank lending & greed profiteering, the old school tie & increase Municipal Council Taxation e.t.c than just purely demographic cycles.
Yes, I would like previously Industrial land to be used for something else too, but that doesn't seem to happen either, wherever you go its the same story, blocks of flats & houses, no new green spaces & seemingly little development for work opportunities by comparison.
It would seem that within BSA, a divisive "Class" orientated tier system & too many people without knowledge or interest in motorcycles, helped to break the cohesiveness of the Industry as a whole, as identified by Hopwood combined with an overbearing Senior Management .
However, BSA was beyond doubt the only real chance of a possible future survival of the industry, in terms of plant & expertise. The fact is the crisis situation was betrayed internally on the 14th of March 1973, when leaked information wiped the share-prices to zero on the Stock market. Industrial espionage of this type has been all to common & the concerns voiced @ that time, that Norton was the "tail wagging the dog", proved on reflection to be tragically true.
Hopwood's Modular approach was & would be the only ideal concept ever drawn up to ever get the British bike industry back on its feet as a volume producer. Why Norton & Dennis Poore was put forward as the lead role to absorb the larger more modern & expansive BSA concern remains a mystery except to say that Manganese- Bronze were enabled to get many of BSA's profitable sub- manufacturing non-motorcycle groups @ a bargain price & this smacks of some sort of Insider dealing in my view aided & abetted by a naive Government Ministers, or were they?
Although this post has attracted quite a few replies, in the main it is only a few individuals that have made the effort to share their views, long-live Democracy & that's one can of worms even I'm not going to open....good point about the Environment though!
The value of people to a Nation is what's is in their heads & how expansive their thought forms can be with respect to being intelligently usable for the benefit of all, or conversely controlled in repressive regimes and stunted, a concept fully embraced by many publications produced by the Murdoch clan!
JBW
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Another problem was that even if BSA had been able and willing to produce something to rival Honda, the media ( and the sheep one meets in every pub) would have decried it to the point that the whole thing would have become self-fulfilling prophecy.
Remember Rover and the comments of that oh so funny little trio on Top Gear? I surprised that the bubble-topped c*nt Clarkson has the nerve to show his long smirking face in the West Midlands...
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At least we are in agreement re Denis Poore and his antics?
However, it was an industry that was doomed, you cannot have a successful business when the workers and the management hate and detest each other and spend more time trying to get one up over each other than manufacturing a decent product.
Back in the 1970s I opened a bike shop stocked with several basements full of Triumph spares, from defunct dealers. In those days one could do that. I was also a long time Triumph nut and mechanic.
Things went really well on the Triumph side as I had masses of hard to get parts; then I got asked for newer stuff, so the idea of a Triumph spares agency grew; a mate approached the Triumph stand at a show and mooted the idea to the rep. She was full of enthusiasm for the support so I approached the Meriden co-op.
Big mistake.
No I could not have a spares agency unless I was approved. I pointed out that I had a large and growing customer base, all keen to keep Triumphs on the road.
They only sold spares through Triumph dealers.
OK I will sell your new bikes then.....
If, big IF, I was "approved" to sell their co-op bikes I had to order a minimum of three bikes, cash up front in full and no delivery date available, or promised.
and in any case they were not interested in supplying spares older machines either.
That my friends is a true story.
In the early 1960's Honda spread out crates of 3x Honda 50 machines to any one with a shop front who would put down a fiver and pay the rest on sale of bike. Gilberts of Catford became a huge Honda dealer that way.
Chinese bikes seem to be repeating the idea.
Its seems to be in this country a point of honour to have each side detest each other, each side constantly endeavouring to outdo or put one over on the other.
One side, the unions, try to grab every penny in wages/perks liberty taking that it can.[ ie London underground.]
The other side tries to do the worker out of every penny it can, by paying as low a wage as possible, and, getting back to the elephant in the room, by importing labour.
A house near me, a listed building, has just been bought for 7 million quid; its new owner,a hedge fund manager, immediately brought in Ukrainian and Polish labour. to renovate the decor and plumbing.
I know because I talked to the guys.
Its not as if there is a shortage of willing skilled plumbing/painters/builders around here.
So that's a little more resentment in this area against imported labour and the moneyed classes. and a bit more wealth and tax income exported.
That's how the two problems are inextricable.
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Well ,you men have said it all. More than I dare but here are some prompts to stir it some more.
1 "Did you like that?" was FREDS phrase as he demolished chimneys whilst preserving what he could.
2 Some of my best friends BIKES are black didn`t refer to their owners skin colour.
3 I too have been helped/saved by more brown people than white.
4 Muslims aren`t bad people but their religion rules their lives.
5 If I lived in their countries conditions and knew I would be welcomed in europe I would be here tomorrow. I drive round France and the cities there are equally as full of Africans and Muslim women due to their having had an Empire like Queen Victorias Who was of german descent. they are full of Turks, I don`t know why. It`s the same in Spain with moroccans and South Americans. I`m starting to rant ,I`ll stop now. why the European Uneconomic community let anyone east of poland in I cant imagine. It won`t stop their local wars.
6 My father worked at Tandons and I keep intending to write about it but I thought this site was dying when you look at the response to some of the forums. Tandon was Indian by the way. But not Muslim.
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Its not as if there is a shortage of willing skilled plumbing/painters/builders around here.
No, and it's not as if those Poles etc do an excellent job for 50p either. If they did, maybe it would be possible to understand the thinking behind it.
Reminds me of Birmingham Council recently who made about 100 IT staff redundant, and "out-sourced" their work to India. When the local news programmes interviewed the various parties, the Chairman of the local Chamber of Commerce praised the council's actions, and said more should follow suit in an effort to reduce costs.
Clearly this congenital idiot couldn't follow the reasoning that now there was yet another 100 families who wouldn't be spending in his Commerce members' shops/pubs/cafes/etc and the "money" had been exported to India.
Seems like the idiot middle classes are still making the same old mistakes they've been making since the end of the War, Gawd help us...
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The above comments re Muslims being friendly and helpful, is quite correct.Especially when in their own countries where it is an traditional obligation to help the traveller, anybody read Dervla Murphys books? where she travelled alone by push bike through all those 'dodgy' countries.
The lone traveller through Iraq Iran Syria on the hippy trail also found the same thing to be true.
there is a big BUT factor....... these lone travellers were seen as poor people on a par with the locals and not as a threat. Its the same in most underdeveloped countries, my wife travelled the length of South America on her own, nothing but kindness from the local folk.
What we are importing here is a brand of religious fanaticism by brainwashed illiterates who have absolutely no concept of modern life or of western North European values.
Their object is to drag us into the middle ages once more.
They are funded, in order to promote their own extreme version of the religion, by the Saudis to whom our establishment seems to be in thrall; Its the Saudi's behind the ruckus in Syria and the Arab spring BS.
Ideally I would like to see the dominant powers in the world join forces and beat the crap out of Saudi and run the oil industry between us, I would happily live out my life on petrol rationing if need be to see that.
But that's me being extreme and unreasonable . Much the same as the Taliban, whose paymaster is Saudi Arabia
But I wont expand on who is behind false flag attacks or are known to make war by deception.
Look that up for yourselves.
On motorcycle topic, a good deal this whole Middle East disturbance is the result of the interference of the sodomite motorcyclist Lawrence of Arabia and his fantasies.
Don't get me stated on the quality of imported craftsmanship, too many stories; the amounts of money exported by immigrants to this country, from what ever source, honest toil, or fraud is frightening, and there is no proper audit.
PsTandon was Indian by the way. But not Muslim.
I have Indian friends if you want to really offend any of them, assume they are Muslim, or describe them as 'Asian'
PPSQueen Victorias Who was of german descent.
I would say she was all German and so was her husband, and her descendants, till they got the wind up and changed their name in 1914.
As for that I regard the Germans, along with all the Nordic races as brothers, we are all of Celtic-Anglo-Saxon origin and culture.
That culture is increasingly under threat.
Our ancestors hewed these lands out of the retreating glaciers and wilderness, its ours, we stole it from no-one. We have nowhere else to go.
We have a right to defend it.
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Hi,
I'm not interested in making anyone look foolish, but myth can be a dangerous thing..when not on a bedrock of truth. Firstly, the Ice Age ended in Europe as recently as perhaps circa 15,000-10,000 before present depending on where you take a geographical point, parts of SE England were never glaciated, but it would have been far too cold exhibiting vast areas of permafrost no one could have inhabited here till the Ice sheets were well in retreat, slithering back into the Arctic & their Scandinavian heartlands.
According to perceived wisdom, Homo erectus was the only species present for most of this era, the early middle Pleistocene, that is, this may or may not be true, but ancestors of modern humans appear much later in Palaeolithic times, no Celt, Saxon or Dane ever had to hew any glacial ice, from the last great glaciation across Europe!
35,000 years ago, in mainland Europe Neanderthal & Cro-magnon faced each other as the glacier/s retreated.
The idea of a Nordic super-race working together is a complete myth in historical terms at least, dreamt up by the dreamers interested in promoting the Third Reich.
The sad fact is that if most people knew Nordic/Norse history better they would know that allegiance was too your Father, family, warrior band & people of kith & kin, what mattered was reputation above all else & that got loyalty & Legend & into Valhalla. Take for example Ragnor Lodbrok & his sons Ivor, Halfdan, Ubba, being the most famous & fiercest, who came to claim England as their own, due to English treachery.
Whilst the Angles & Saxons were fighting each other in the 9th century, they started a conflict in 850 leading to the Great Heathen army invasion of 864, the death of Eric Bloodaxe in 954 in Cumbria another turning point, with the first phase ending in ending in 1003 with the invasion of Swein Forkbeard a period of circa 150 years of on & off fighting, then a quite period under Canute.
At the battle of Stamford bridge, Harold Godwinson, who has incidentally a Danish mother, carries out the defeat of Harold Hadrada in 1066 & consequentially his defeat by William who was in effect by a third generation Norman-French, his ancestry tracing back to Rollo the founder of the Norman state.
Can you see here any cooperation between Angle, Saxon, Dane & Frank all subject peoples to the Nordic myth hierarchy?
I have read Bulwer-Lytton, Otto Rahn, & lots of that stuff, of more significance is the Spear of destiny by Trevor Ravenscroft, & are probably more widely read on the topic than most. Hitler etal falsely blamed Germany's ills on the Jews, with the Protocols of the Elders of Zion, passed round as truth to stir up hate, by the way the Iberians were here in Britain, before the Celts .
Having been in Eastern Europe & seen the damage & heard tales relating to the breakup of former Yugoslavia, neighbour killing neighbour, death squads, I consider anyone advocating this type of action now or in the future, are by definition on the fringe of being quite disturbed, there has to be other solutions to racial disharmony than genocide.
Incidentally, T E Lawrence's motorcycles were called Boanerges after the twin Norse Gods of Fire.
This is not a personal attack on anyone, but is here to inform the unwary of truth against myth in propaganda.
Enough is Enough any more talk has to be of Motorcylces.
JBW