classic motorcycle forum
Motorcycle Discussions => British Bikes => Topic started by: gizzy on August 04, 2017, 03:50:56 PM
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Hello! Newbie here. Can anyone on here tell me what model this Albion gearbox is? Or any other information you would care to share. Thank you, hope everyone has a good day!
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Hi and Welcome ;D
There should be some letter/number stamping on the kickstart side that will tell the model
It looks like the lightweight type from the pics
If you reduce the photo size it will be easier to see them on the forum
John
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Thanks John. It has 20M stamped on the kicker cover. Sorry about the size of pics, I haven't learned how to reduce them yet. I'm not very computer literate. LOL Any other info would be appreciated. I know next to nothing about it. Mainly wondering if it is a 2 speed, 3 speed or maybe a 2 or 3 speed with reverse? Or maybe what it was used on? Thanks again.
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Albion made that style of gearbox from the 1920's until British industry went belly up in the 60's. Initially in motorcycles they ended up in all sorts of industrial and light agricultural machinery. Albion made a gazillion variants of it all with basically the same 3-speed internals. They come in top mount, bottom mount and pivot mounting variants each with alternative chain lines (The distance from the centre line of the box to the final drive sprocket and similar for the clutch sprocket.) The kick start shaft comes in various lengths also and the actual kickstart comes with various offsets. Then we get on to the clutch which comes in several configurations as well.
Combine all these things and you get the gazillion varieties I mention above. Its a matter of luck finding out what a particular box was intended for. The common ID is a three letter, three number configuration. Not that it helps much.
At one stage I had quite a range of jigs and fixtures to hold various bits for various repairs. They can be made quite sweet in their action if you take a little care but they suffer from the standard wide ratio problem of all three speed boxes.
They're an easy box to work on and they work well but it drives you nuts sorting out the particular combination of bits that your bike uses. I think that's why I have about a dozen of them sitting under my bench. All NQR - Not Quite Right.
Cheers,
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Thanks 33d6. So this is a 3 speed? Can the chain line be changed (make the distance between sprockets wider) Thanks again.
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Yes, its a 3 speed box and technically, yes you can change the chain line by fitting the alternative main shaft but good luck with that. Finding specific parts is a real song and dance hence the 'orrible remains under my bench.
I think your box is a type EJ featherweight three speeder intended for up to 150cc engines only but many got used for far heavier duty. If you clean it off it should have more numbers on it than the 20M you mention.
To help manufacturers Albion would put out little booklets of line drawings giving all the necessary overall dimensions for designers to work around. Always useful to keep an eye out for them. I got copies of a couple of them from the VMCC Library.
Cheers,
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Thanks again 33d6. I appreciate it.
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Hi gizzy,
33d6 has answered your questions,
The boxes with reverse gear fitted are easily spotted because they have a "bump" on the main casing where the reversing gear fits
I got a book on them on ebay some years ago,
Like 33d6 I have a couple of "not quite right" boxes ::) ( bigger than the one you have)
But, I managed to find enough bits to build a 4 speed to go into my wee OK Supreme
I'm sure the extra gear will help a lot
All I need is time to get round to doing the change over
John
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How do you know how big my box is? :o LOL
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Hi gizzy,
LOL indeed ::)
The ultra lightweight boxes (up tp 150cc according to the book) have the clutch arm and gear change in the positions in your pics, model CJ 2 speed or model EJ 3 speed
The model "E" ones like my OK have a clutch arm that curls around the front of the gearbox and the gear change lever
comes out the top of the outer case
Some google images attached,
Some copies of Albion manuals available here
http://www.britishmotorcyclemanuals.com/acatalog/Albion-gearboxes.html
John
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I don't see any parts books or service manuals for the EJ 3 speed model?
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Hi Gizzy,
As a generalisation the British motorcycle industry wasn't that good at providing decent service manuals in the early days. That's why publishers like Haynes were so successful as they filled a big gap. Back in the day various publishers printed general information books like "Motorcycles and how to manage them" which gave a general overview of what to look for and these are still around and have a certain value to newcomers to the hobby.
About the only proper workshop instructions I've ever seen for Albion was a chapter in "Motor Cycle Repair and Upkeep" published by Newnes in the early 1930's. The occasional copy of the series still comes up on eBay now and then.
As a rule of thumb once you have pulled down one Albion 3 speeder you have pulled down them all. You can see the same designers hand in them all. Parts may be heavier or larger but the principles remain the same and the methods of operation tend to remain the same. The same types of problem tend crop up regardless of which particular box you are working on.
Also remember you will never find a spare parts list that claims Albion made this box for 40 years and this list will cover the whole 40 years plus every minor variation made for any particular buyer. You will only ever find general lists that require you to think a bit. That's how the world was pre computer and pre internet. The neck top computer got worked a lot harder.
Cheers,
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I understand. Thanks 33d6
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I don't see any parts books or service manuals for the EJ 3 speed model?
Try here http://www.nationalmotorcyclemuseum.co.uk/product/albion-gearboxes-1931-to-1934-illustrated-spares-list-for-midget-gearboxes-models-ej-bj-and-cj-only-tiger1772/ (http://www.nationalmotorcyclemuseum.co.uk/product/albion-gearboxes-1931-to-1934-illustrated-spares-list-for-midget-gearboxes-models-ej-bj-and-cj-only-tiger1772/)
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Thanks ScottT63, much appreciated.
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Hi again Gizzy,
I told you of Albion content in the "Motor Cycle Repair and Upkeep" series published by Newnes and that it sometimes appeared on eBay. Someone must have been listening as a couple of copies are on EBay at the moment. Both the full set of three volumes and the odd singleton volume. The full set is worth the bother if you are seriously in to late vintage motorcycles.
Cheers,
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Thanks 33d6, I'll check them out.