classic motorcycle forum

Hi R.

Thanks for the prompt reply. I’ve looked at the bike you suggest on Sheldon’s. It looks superficially the same, but differs in the details i’ve mentioned:
1. The top triple clamp on my bike does not take a single bar with the regular four bolt clamps, but instead takes two separate short bars that slot into two holes in the triple clamp casting, similar to some models of Talisman. They are held there with a pinch bolt for each bar.
2. The frame design is slightly different at the meeting of the vertical tube and the tube that runs under the tank. The red Universal has a single tube bent into shape, whereas my bike has two tubes brazed into a cast lug where the two tubes meet.
3. The toolbox on my bike is the cylindrical typenthat sits behind the engine, not the two saddle type tool kits that sit either side at the rear of the frame.

I believe the engine should be a 175cc, as you suggest, but what I actually have is a 197cc from an Ambassador.

The only picture of anything like a complete bike that matches mine is the green bike in my post above. This is the only picture I have ever found that matches my bike, despite many hour spent searching. Physically at least it matches my bike perfectly. I’m waiting on some additional pictures from the owner to confirm various details, including the frame number.

When I posted back in 2015 it was suggested that I visit to VMCC library to see what they have. I think this could be my next step. I may also contact DVLA, but I’m pretty sure their records don’t go back that far I suspect. I believe the bike was found in Ireland, so I may try and contact their equivalent of DVLA as well.

Cheers

Good evening all.

Back in 2015 I posted on this forum asking for help to identify an Excelsior motorcycle that I had acquired. The frame number is C1/326.

At the time I mistakenly came to the conclusion that this ‘C1’ prefix referrred directly to a model variant and through eliminating various posibilities I concluded I had a model C1 Condex built in 1956. I now see that this isn’t the case as I’ve obtained a Shell Servicing Data Sheet for a C1 Condex that gives detailed spefication for the bike, including the fact that both D12 and C1 Condex models had girder front forks. My bike has telescopic front forks.

Within the Excelsior model range there were both C1 Courier and C1 Condex models, and possibly more. So, i reason, may be it’s a C1 Courier. However, pictures I can find online confirm that this isn’t the case either. Early C1 Courier models are superficially similar (telescopic front forks, plunger rear suspension, traditional single sprung saddle etc) but also have the small triangular tool/storage boxes either side of the rear wheel. My bike has the cylindrical toolbox beneath the saddle mounted on the vertical tube behind the engine. Later C1 Courier models had telescopic swingarm rear suspension.

Reading elsewhere on this site there are some authoritative comments made by 33d6 indicating that this prefix doesn’t tie up nicely with a model number. So...where do I go next...

Well, as luck would have it I found a picture of what I believe isn’t an identical bike to mine on Sheldon’s Emu. I’ve been in touch with the owner of the bike and will hopefully be able to confirm fairly soon that it has a similar frame number, not that this will necessarily lead to identifying what this bike is. But I have posted a picture of the bike, plus some detailed shots of my bike, just in the hope that someone may be able to help me.

So one of the pictures is a nearly complete bike, currently residing in Africa and still running apparently, that I believe to be identical to mine. It’s missing the cylindrical toolbox and headlamp, but in every other respect, including the colour, I believe it’s the same.

The other pictures are of components of my bike, the top triple clamp and the frame that pertain to specific details that I hope help identify the exact model I have.

If it helps here are some obvious clues...the upper triple clamp has the type of fitting for two separate handlebars (as on a Talisman) rather than the more conventional four bolt clamps. The frame tube below the tank and vertical tube behind the engine are two separate tubes joined by a cast lug with fittings for the tank and seat (as on a Talisman) rather than the single bent tube as seen on say, the Roadmaster. The forks are of a similar type to those on a later model Consort, I.e. With short tapered section at top of fork, rather than the longer taper as on the Roadmaster or Talisman.

Any thoughts or help would be immensely appreciated. My son and I, who in the process of restoring the bike, are just beginning to run out of options for ever finding out what it is.

Thanks

The tank shape looks the same, as do the front mounts. Is it for sale?

If anyone has read my other post on the "Identify these bikes" area, you'll now know that I have an answer. The bike is an Excelsior Condex C1, probably from 1956 but I'm still working on that.

Thanks for help ideas.

Now in search of a tank, wheels or just hubs (2.5"x19"), head lamp lense and chrome surround, rear lamp and seat.

Regards

That's a very refreshing attitude to hear. Never been a rivet counter myself so am totally with you on the engine issue. I just want make this pile of rusting parts back into a nice bike again and enjoy it.

I am reminded of an incident ai witnessed probably 35 years ago...my Dad had a vintage car, a 1935 Riley Kestrel 15/6, and we used to go to occasional Riley club days. On one occasion we went to a driving test day at Brooklands and lots of other club members turned up with their beautiful pieces of machinery to have some fun. Anyway, about half way through the day some lads from South London rolled up in a Riley RM, a big, luxurious post war saloon. They had stripped out the Riley running gear, fitted a big Ford V8 and automatic gearbox, custom suspension front and rear and painted flames all down the side of the front wings and bonnet. Of course all the Riley club members were totally horrified and refused to talk to the lads who owned it, completely ignoring the fact that it was a completely beautiful piece of work and probably the best presented car there that day. Also overlooked the fact that it was used every day!

Thanks for your help.
Regards

Hmmm...so it looks like I have an Ambassador engine with an Excelsior frame! Plot is thickening minute by minute. It's not in the photos but I also have an Ambassador tank. This is beginning to look like a project that someone started and possibly mistook the frame for an Ambassador.

I will persevere and see what I can establish from the frame with the VMCC.

Thanks again for you help.
Regards

In reply to iansoady, no I haven't been to Allen house though it sounds like a visit would be very worthwhile. Whilst motorcycling isn't new to me, VMCC and this forum are new so I'm still finding my way around.

In reply to R, the Bonhams add is potentially quite useful. It implies that the C1 was essentially the same as the C2 Courier except for the lighting circuitry. If this is the case, then what I have is not a Courier as the frame and forks differ from that shown in pictures of the C2 Courier that are available on the net.

Seems like a trip to Burton-upon-Trent is on the cards, but if anyone has a similar frame number on their Excelsior then I'd still be very interested to know.

Regards

Possibly a coat of lacquer over the top after the transfers have been applied. Many modern bikes have tank transfers and stickers applied rather than names painted on, and then a coat of lacquer applied afterwards.

If you can afford a second set of transfers I guess it would make sense to run a trial first on a test piece made up with the same paint etc., rather than risk trashing your hard work if it doesn't
work well.

Hope this helps.