classic motorcycle forum
Motorcycle Discussions => British Bikes => Topic started by: Conrad668s on June 21, 2013, 11:33:35 AM
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Hi all,
After riding everything from 2 strokes to Yamaha R1's I feel it's time to get myself something with a soul.
My fast bike days are over and I want something I can enjoy owning, looking at, and plodding around on.
My heart is telling me BSA B31 as I just love the look of the bike in hardtail form. I've also got a really good BSA mechanic locally.
Anyone got any opinions either way - price, ownership, maintenance, riding etc.
I would occasionally like to take a pillion out - will it have enough power to pull 2 people around country roads?
Thanks in advance
Conrad
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B31 is a very slow bike solo , but two up :( :(and ridgid , go for a swing arm b33 , if it must be ridgid the ariel is a better machine i think , or plunger , I really don't know what to do with this one
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If I where you I would go for the bigger A7 or A10 which would certainly be good for two up and can plod around country lanes but give a little bit more power for the main roads.
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a7s and a10s might be a bit expensive ( more so ridgid a7) , and might take a bit more looking after than a single bsa , if you want to plod stick to singles ( side valve ariel bsa norton or ohv panther ) are the best ploders that ive owned , there may be others .
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The A10's I've looked at have been £5k+ for a decent model.
I'll be 2 up probably 30% of the time I'm out on it. The b31 seems good value for money, reliable'ish, and possibly a bike I won't lose money on?
Lets be fair - the styling is something else - it's a work of art - or is that just me?
Again, I'm no expert, that's why I'm asking.
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the british ridgid singles are a work of art (girder or tele ) , but the b31 may not be the best . cluch ,chaincase , etc , V/P b21 is better but 250 , for looks and style any british singlr does it for me . so a good choice what ever you decide ...... you wont lose money if you look carfully at what you buy.... if it needs fetaling and cannot be rode .....walk away unless its a basket case
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The B31 is fine and will do everything you want but if you buy a rigid frame version your pillion passenger won't like it. The pillion ride on any rigid frame is uncomfortable regardless of make.
All old British bikes require a little more regular maintenance and fettling than later machinery. Some say that is part of the charm, others don't like it. All have their little foibles but after 60 years they are well known as are the appropriate tweaks.
Generally speaking all early postwar British 350's were light and lively but as they were "improved" throughout the 50's they became more and more stodgy, overweight and sluggish. It is a delicate balance to buy one retaining the happy qualities of the early postwar period and is comfortable for your passenger.
The plunger frame B31 may suit both of you but I'd suggest you put passenger comfort high on the list if you want domestic harmony.
Cheers,
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"rigid frame version your pillion passenger won't like it" .................... forgot that one , if its your wife she"ll only go on it once , B31 two up might do 45mph ? 50 on a very long straight and only the rear brake is of any use , round town they can be a nighmare
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Of course the drum brakes on any classic bike aren't as good as disc brakes on a modern bike. Disc brakes were introduced to improve braking performance and a good thing too but that doesn't mean drums are no good. They are just different and the rider has to change their riding habits to suit the abilities of the brakes in question just as they also have to change to suit the old fashioned engine characteristics. Isn't that one of the reasons riders go classic? Riding a classic requires much more thought and input from the rider to ride smoothly and well but the increased grin factor and riding satisfaction makes it all worth while. Isn't that why we do it?
It is also quite possible to get quite reasonable performance out of drum brakes including the B31 brake which to my mind is no different from anything else from the period. There are various little tweaks applicable to them all.
Finally, it doesn't matter that it's a B31 in question, 90% of us would disagree with whatever you had in mind. That is just normal motorcycle stuff. We all think we've got the right bike and anything else is wrong. Go ahead and buy your B31, mate. You'll have a lot of fun but in a few years you'll be looking around thinking "I wonder what a Velo, or an Ariel, or a Matchless (or whatever) would be like?" You'll be like the rest of us and just want to try them all.
Cheers,
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and finish up with a bloody garage full lol
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you can change your riding habits all you like that will not stop the driver of the ABS micra in front slaming his brakes on , I have seen recently a triumph with a twin drum fitted , hed used both sides of a 7in full width iron triumph drum with two right hand lower legs , looked good , I like the ariel setup as you can bring the trailing edge into contact with out the need for beer can shims (often found ) some jumbelers are selling longer arms , this will not work but means the leaver hits the bars that much sooner when the brake fades , I think you may find two up riding a B31 a very exciting experience , that does not stop me riding mine but never two up , take some spare under ware with you .
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So upgraded front brake could be required then?
What upgrades are available and what would the cost be?
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I fitted a twin leading shoe from a 69 Bonnie to my Norton ES2 front... it winds the "rivet counters" up but by the cringe it stops well and makes for more confident riding
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most round here are running jap front ends with discs (triumph f/ends have dryed up) twin leading shoe triumph hubs are nice (not comical I trust) but to expensive , a complete jap front end is the cheap way to go and you can change to tapper head bearings whilt there , the forks and brakes work very well but they do totally spoil a original machine I admit , moto cross front ends are cheap run a 21 front wheel and you can feed the stantion trou the top yock for ride height .
stuff like this on ebay all the time £150........... Suzuki DR600 Complete Front End ideal supermoto or chopper Project BREAKING BIKE
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It seems to be a regular thing, people saying that the front brake on their British bike is not good enough. The fact is its as good as it needs to be if correctly set up and adjusted, it's not necessary to start modifying them.
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may have been ok in the day with cars running cable brakes ,but in modern traffic they are Sh*t reguardless of skimming relineing etc standard brakes will lead to some heart stopping moments for sure , thats if you intend useing the bike ,but please tell me if you know how to stop brake fade on a 7in bsa half width hub ( we wont mention the 6 in) it might be usefull ;D
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I totally agree... they were as good as it got in their day. The bike has remained the same modern traffic certainly hasn't. BTW.. not a comical hub front brake for sure. Although I understand if you change the lever on comical hubs to a modern after market longer version that they are much better.
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without changing the hand leaver how can this be ? if the brake arm is longer it means more travel at the handle bar leaver , you will increase the mechanical advantage I agree but this is not the problem if you still have a grip , these hubs fade and when the leaver meets the bars your f***ed , the twin shoe you are using , straight or bell crank , is the best front drum triump/bsa ever made and are very expensive now ( I also have one fitted to a bike also a comical hub one to a triumph 500 , the comical one is poor and its easy to see why ) pulling one shoe on and then the next is not good and I can think of no other that operates in this way , Hams hall thanks
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What you say makes good sense, I have always listened to advice and kept well clear of the comical hub.
I did buy a job lot of stuff for £250 which included a bottom half of a 500 triumph engine a few years ago and it contained a double sided twin leading shoe brake which I later discovered was from a TZ Yamaha just before discs came in. That brake I swear is as good as any disc and it looks the part too.
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TZ Yamaha .............. very nice and ive seen this wheel fetch £1500 , never had one my self , early kettle f/wheels also now prized for the classic race boys , I will post some pics of a hub I have here and I think its bsa maybe m20 but have to say it was quite a good brake , came with a 500 ariel which was fitted bsa girder front end
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here are some of the hubs fitted to bikes here , only one I would say would save you from a burka clad driver round here and maybe not two up , the rest no way , to improve the brakes I skim the hubs with the rim laced ON and reline the shoes , I also shim the trailling edge until it touches the drum (not on ariels) is there any thing else you would recommend . these are my feelings from personal experience your b31 may do a stoppe , if so please show me
standard B33 ok but bike is to heavy , the smaller 7in and 6in (not for road use ) forget it , Allaha here we come
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the best one triumph / bsa ever made not cheap now , but do work well
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ariel with adjustable trailling shoe , should work better , two up forget it , Allaha here we come
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don't know but think bsa was fitted to girders , wide shoes and a good brake , two up forget it , Allaha here we come
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c15 b40 etc , solo rubbish , Allaha here we come
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comical hub prone to cracking , solo ok below 30mph , two up forget it , Allaha here we come
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This is where mine finished up
(http://www.vintagebike.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/gallery/hybrid/norton-imp-2-760x570.jpg)
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very nice and needed I guess to stop a imp powerd monster , looks like you don't risk it two up mind ;D
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She rides a 1200cc Harley... at least I can show her my arse on the imp! Has to be pretty twisty to do it on a 500 single TBH!
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my wife sees my arse every morning as I get out me pit , 1200 Harleys ( take it sportster and not old shovel) handle better than some/most think , but a good 500 single down a lane I think would av it just :D
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Just...
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Indeed. Sticking some mongrel Jappa front end on an expensive Meriden Triumph is only feasible if you're building a bike from bits and really don't care what it looks like or what it does to the resale value.
The Triumph TLS brakes are good (even the comical ones) as are the discs. Quality relined shoes from someone like Saftek and decent heavy cables are the way to go.
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Surely if you are racing it in a classic class it has to have the original wheels/brakes?
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i dont think this is a race bike were talking about , for road use , i have tryed all the things rex has mentioned accept heavy cable and some of the modern cables do seam poor . is it the cable that is the weak point and to blame for the fade ?
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Indeed. Sticking some mongrel Jappa front end on an expensive Meriden Triumph is only feasible if you're building a bike from bits and really don't care what it looks like or what it does to the resale value
Doesn't mean it's there forever, just helps with modern roads
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draged a 500 triumph out yesterday just to take a closer look , this one has a comical front wheel fitted (the bikes a 1958 3ta) . the cable is already the larger heavey weight type , skimed drum and new lineings , this brake is still poor and i would drop a jap front end in it if i intended useing it (its not standard now so of little value) but does go well , engine is a latter t100ss so the thought of slowing from @100mph with this setup concerns me , emergency stop forget it , rear wheel (QD) is A1
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Doesn't mean it's there forever, just helps with modern roads
True enough, but then how far does anyone take that logic? Most riders seem to keep it roughly original and ride to the bike's capabilities rather than up-rate in an attempt to make it something it isn't.
If you want to stop on a sixpence wouldn't you just buy a Honda?
"100MPH T100SS"....uh-huh... ;) Not more than once though.
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"@100mph"............... no problem and most nights the week coming back from the pub when I was younger 8), the engine is standard single carb , 3134s R followers and it flys . buy a Honda front end I agree and most of the british bikes round here ( that are used ) are not standard and im pleased to say more are slowly coming out , bobbed , f trackers , rats , some chops (not many thank god) standard machines are to expensive so people are forced to build there own and improve them at the same time , anyone can build a standard machine
heres a bit from cycle mag (this is the twin carb version I know) they do mention the front brake
Lightweight performer
By the standards of the day, T100s were acceptably quick, reliable and comfortable. Cycle magazine tested the new Triumph T100 R in 1967 and recorded a 14.9 second standing quarter at a shade under 90mph, concluding that it had close to the performance of a Bonneville yet could be “whipped around” like a lightweight. Even the electrics came in for praise. Cycle’s only concern was the 7-inch single-leading-shoe front brake, which was described only as “adequate.”
Cycle World, meanwhile, discovered a “Jekyll and Hyde” personality: below 4,500rpm, the Daytona would work like “a strong 350”; but shifting instead at 6,000rpm, they found a whole new level of performance, and a top speed of 105mph. They also praised the T100R’s gear-shifting, ease of starting, comfort and electrics — except for the feeble horn — and found the brakes “more than adequate.” The improved handling came in for specific mention and was attributed to increased diameter frame tubes and a new fork design.
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all this f brake talk has made me drag my old 3ta out , not been on the road since about 1976/77 some very happy memorys for me so will give it a blast for old time sake . lost the seat some how
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That's what mates are for ;)