Any idea on this rear wheel ?

[Jonny The Goat]

Hi, Today I bought a vintage 26" wire wheel, sprocket and hub from our local car boot. It came with a Goodyear Cord 26" x 2 1/2"- 2 3/4" tyre on in good order for its age. I would guess a date of maybe early 20's. Anyway the wheel is a bit odd. it has 20 spokes on the plain side and 20 spokes on the sprocket side but on the sprocket side it also has 20 more spokes that have been cut off around 1" from the wheel There is no place these could of connected to. I wondered if in the past the rim had come off something else and been used on this hub. Any idea what would of had 40 spokes on one side and 20 on the other? As always the old seller swore blind it was off of one of T E laurances Broughs . When did chain drive wheels come in?
        Cheers, Jon   

[L.A.B.]

Many early motorcycles had a chain drive to the rear wheel for starting and applying the usual 'LPA' up hills using the pedals and a belt 'rim' for the engine drive.



Or, the wheel possibly had what's known as a 'dummy rim brake'. These were common during the 20's.

[cardan]

Hi Jon,
The 20 extra spokes were for the belt rim. For some bikes (like early Triumphs) the belt rim was attached to the exiting spoke, while other used the extra short spokes, and sometimes both methods were used.
Believe it or not, chain drive dates from the earliest days of the motorcycle c1900, but it was not popular in the early days as it was considered harsh. As chains improved, and various cush drives were perfected, chain drive became more common. Belt final drive had pretty-much disappeared by the mid 1920s.
If you post a photo of your wheel and the hub we can probably identify it.
Cheers
Leon

[cardan]

That's a lovely Douglas LAB - just my cup of tea. 1910-ish I think.

Leon

[Jonny The Goat]

Ah, I see. I never really looked to see how the belt drive rim was connected . I think looking at it that it's the same as the one on the BSA above. Was that a 26"?. I should of said the 40 spokes are on the plane side and not the sprocket side in my first post. Cheers, Jon.

[Jonny The Goat]

One more.

[Jonny The Goat]

Actually
 looking more closely the BSA sprocket holes look round. This one has six holes and they are sort of triangle in shape with the point closest to the spindle hole blunted off. Maybe this will also help with the ID
        Cheers.

[chaterlea25]

Hi Jonny,
I can tell you its not like the BSA pictured, the BSA as you mention has round holes in the dished sprocket
and the sprocket is held on with a single large diamater  "C spanner nut"
Those BSA's are peculiar in another respect as the bearing cones are part of the solid spindle, the cups are then threaded into the hub, one fixed and one adjustable
The spindle has flats that take the cams for adjusting the chain and a square end to turn it
The result of this is that the wheel nuts do not have a full thread to act on spindle
I am looking for such a spindle and sprocket (BTY)

John

[Jonny The Goat]

Hmm, Sounds like I can rule out a BSA then. Any other ideas? As I have never had a bike from this age did a lot of them have big wheels of this size? 26" looks huge
    Jon

[L.A.B.]

Hmm, Sounds like I can rule out a BSA then. Any other ideas?

Why does it matter?

As I have never had a bike from this age did a lot of them have big wheels of this size? 26" looks huge

Perhaps not as big as you think. 26" would be the overall diameter of the tyre and not the rim diameter as used for tyre sizes since WW2 so in modern terms the 'wheel' is probably around 21".   

[Jonny The Goat]

I like to know, knowledge is everything
    As for size the total diameter with the tyre a bit flat it is 28" and the wheel rim is 23".
                   
           Jon.

[cardan]

26" is nominally the outside diameter of the tyre - these days we measure the rim. "26 x 2 1/2  / 2 1/4" on the tyre means that the appropriate rim size is about 22 1/2" o/a diameter, rather than a tyre labelled "26 x 2 1/2" which went on a 21" rim. It's a long story...
Anyway, you have a rear wheel from the 1920s missing its brake rim. The 6-bolts pattern is pretty nondescript, but the hub is possibly a British Hub Company item that was used by hundreds of makers.
A nice relic, but given the level of rust it's probably not of too much use to anyone. Under the tyre the rim will be badly rusted.
Cheers
Leon

[Jonny The Goat]

The rust is not as bad as it looks. Its not deep and even the spokes still seem strong. It runs true and the spokes that are on it are not bent. I would wire brush it and give it a oil and I would think it would be fine. I have bikes with thinner spokes with the same level of patina . Maybe someone would want it for the hub. Another really mad thing is that I have just inflated the tire. I have only stuck 16 - 18 psi in it but it seems to be holding. I would guess there is a inner tube in there? and that its been there for a long time but seems OK. The tire has lots of tread and only has a bit of crazing on the same spot on both sides where its been sitting for years. When did they stop making these tires? Any ideas. Also now I have it inflated I have measured it again and the exact diameter is 28.5", this seems odd as it clearly says 26" tyre on it. I may clean it up and just see if I can find a spot to hang it up or if not stick it on the Bay to see if its of any use to a 20's bike owner.
               Cheers, Jon