Old photos of a Norton International

[Dave2006]

Unfortunately my father in law Donald Whitehead died earlier this year - after 89 happy years of being a petrol head. He flew in the RAF during the second world war, after the war he raced bikes, then cars and later go carts. A pilot and engineer by trade he spent his career working in the motor industry.

He often spoke fondly of his Norton International - you don't see many exhausts like that! According to the notes on the back of the picture this bike, 'Bigga Banga', posted the second fastest time of the day at the Brighton Speed Trials in 1946.




I took him out on the back of my Honda VFR 800 a couple of years back (when he was well into his 80s) to see what he thought of modern bikes - he was impressed with the handling, the cornering and the brakes. I asked him if he was scared at any stage with the speed and the power - it was then that he reminded me that he used to fly Spitfires for a living and had been shot at by the Luftwaffe 

Hope you enjoy the photos

Dave

[RichP]

Nice photos, Dave. The large capacity fuel tank is quite special. Do you have any further info on the bike ?

The registration HV7778 was issued by East Ham between 1929 and 1938 so it doesn't pin things down much. The survival rate of Internationals is quite good but the number doesn't come up on the DVLA register. Many have though been sold abroad or are no longer road registered.

[R]

Has a dolls head gearbox and fork return damper springs and later type frame, so its 1936 to 1938 style, essentially the same in those years. Looks like a 350cc ?, iron top end.

The muffler is "Brooklands Can" style, added to what looks like a long straight-through pipe (slightly unusual setup), so a bit of Brooklands runnings seems to be suggested (those 'mufflers' were required there to quieten things down for the nearby residents)

That large tank is quite special. Long distance race ?
Does anyone have any thoughts on the double floatchambers visible, now that is really unusual... ??

P.S. Great pics, thanks for posting.

[Dave2006]

Thanks for the comments - all very interesting. Most people just see an old bike, but forum members see fork dampers, float chambers and oversized tanks - love it.

The Brooklands can is a work of art.

Dave

[runesika]

I love the answer to " Were you  scared at any time ? "  Top man .

[Revband]

Hmm oversize tank, twin float chambers, long exhaust pipe with silencer sticking up in the air, road lights.

Could it be that when on speed trials the lights and silencer where removed? and could the tank contain two chambers with different types of fuel for road and race? with the float chambers set at different levels to increase/decrease the fuel supply.

[chaterlea25]

Hi All,
I would think!!! ( 2cents worth )
Big tank, twin float chambers, iron engine = Alcohol based fuel
Straight pipe where allowed and then the can added for the likes of Brooklands
Cheers
John

[Dave2006]

It's a bloomin shame that when older people are still alive we don't ask them this stuff, but when they have gone we dig out their old possessions...

It is an interesting theory though, how common would it have been to run a Norton on alcohol in 1946?

Dave

[rosko]

how common would it have been to run a Norton on alcohol in 1946?

more common than you know, fuel was tightly rationed, but as always ways were found to get round it.
I have heard of a guy who'd who buy scrap Spitfires just for the  high octane aviation fuel in their tanks, then he'd scrap them.

price of those Spitfires was rumoured to be around 25 quid each , makes you weep don't it?

[wetdog]

my farther was also in the RAF and ran a KSS on the road and also sprinted , high octain fuel was easy to get for members of the RAF right up untill he left in 49 and most of the men he knew in the RAF where life long petrol heads , must have been something in the tea

[rosko]

I once  read/heard from somewhere years ago that young men who were keen motorcyclists in those days were the preferred choice for training as fighter pilots as riding a bike gave them a 'feel' for the machine and the conditions under it, truly flying by the seat of your pants...

[Dave2006]

Interesting theories about the high octane fuel - keep them coming.

In terms of buying old Spitfires - have you seen the current story of the enthusiast who has located a load of Spitfires that are buried in Burma and has just been given permission to dig them up? Apparently they were preserved in grease and buried to stop the Japanese from using them at the end of the war. There could be 20 or more. Each could be worth more than £1million. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/destinations/asia/burma/9204921/British-farmers-quest-to-find-lost-Spitfires-in-Burma.html

Dave

[Rex]

£130,000? Silly old fool...

Every serviceman lucky enough to survive WW2 has similar stories of materiel destroyed and discarded. What the Burma vets failed to remember was that the planes (even if they were Spitfires) were doused in petrol set fire to and the charred remains  pushed into a pit by bulldozer. Unwanted scrap was unwanted scrap, and clearly  there would have been no intention to ever use them again.

Anyway, tools, parts and ammo may have been grease packed but a whole plane, even in CKD form? I wouldn't think so...

[rosko]

years ago the Syrian airforce used Spits, and a  book on Spitfiress I read years ago spoke of loads of them parked up and derelict around Damascus airport,I bet they aren't there now

[Tun up]

"Used to fly Spit's" Brilliant, thanks for sharing