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21
British Bikes / Re: Villiers engine in 1930s Waratah
« Last post by R on July 04, 2025, 06:08:35 AM »
Do we have an example of a Waratah that is not an exact Excelsior model ?

I must have skipped class that day. Or my memory has slipped a cog.
And I saved all posts under W
Inc some from elsewheres .....
22
British Bikes / Re: Hot Start Problem
« Last post by R on July 04, 2025, 06:02:28 AM »
No wonder the factory was getting back lotsa bikes with faulty running !
Sounds diabolical.

Just how do you "set the timing by moving the magneto gears"  ??
Or is that the time honoured method of tapping the gearwheel onto the taper, and then locking it with the nut ...
23
British Bikes / Re: Villiers engine in 1930s Waratah
« Last post by cardan on July 04, 2025, 05:59:49 AM »
Thanks for that. I do have a couple of Mk XVI-A engine numbers (prefix AXF) from Waratahs so that will work.

I'm a bit confused because the Villiers book (Browning) says the Mk XVI-A has an "aluminium deflector piston" while Waratah guff in late 1935, for its 1936 model, says two exhaust ports (tick), 67x70 (tick), detachable alloy head (tick), full roller big end (tick), extra long gas tight bronze main bearings (tick), but "alloy flat top piston"!

The XVII-A (BYX prefix) had the flat top piston, but ball mains!

Not to worry - it's a 250 (notice I didn't say 247 or 249!!) Villiers. Should be enough.

Yes, R, all Waratahs from Excelsior from about 1930, prior to that from Sun Cycle & Fittings. Even Excelsior frame numbers, but not necessarily exact Excelsior models.

Cheers

Leon
24
British Bikes / Re: Hot Start Problem
« Last post by cardan on July 04, 2025, 05:42:20 AM »
Oh, and by all means use the BSA method of points 0.003" open with the magneto on full retard and the engine at TDC. But you have to first set the points gap to 12 thou (no doubt listed somewhere in your BSA literature?), then set the timing by moving the magneto gears, not adjusting the points gap.
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British Bikes / Re: Hot Start Problem
« Last post by cardan on July 04, 2025, 05:37:52 AM »
Hi Billington,

In your photo the rubbing block is well past the opening ramp: when it is in this position the points gap should be about 0.012".

For most of the rotation of the magneto the points should be open about 12 thou; for the rest the points should be closed. Only when the rubbing block hits the ramps and begins opening the points will the gap pass (instantaneously) through 0.003". (And again when closing, but this plays no role in the spark.)

When BSA talks about the points being open 0.003", they mean that the rubbing block has hit the ramp and the points have opened about a quarter the way to fully open (0.012"). This defines an exact point in the rotation of the magneto.

You've asked for help, we've provided it with care an attention. Have you considered accepting it? Humour us. Try it out.

Cheers

Leon
26
British Bikes / Re: Villiers engine in 1930s Waratah
« Last post by R on July 04, 2025, 03:54:03 AM »
P.S. The Meritor appears to have a single port Villiers, and the Waratah a twin port.
How does that work ?

Or perhaps the 2nd exhaust is just hiding ??
27
British Bikes / Re: Villiers engine in 1930s Waratah
« Last post by R on July 04, 2025, 02:35:48 AM »
I was involved in the earlier posts !
Having a just postwar 125cc.
Bought from the original owner.
Identical to the Excelsior bar the black (vs maroon) and the decals.
And a few shillings in price.
The 2 shops were only a hundred yards apart in Wentworth Ave.

But don't recall exploring how this evolved pre WW2 ?
The Meritor wasn't mentioned ?
28
British Bikes / Re: Villiers engine in 1930s Waratah
« Last post by 33d6 on July 04, 2025, 12:40:40 AM »
Yes we do. We went down that rabbit hole exhaustively some time back. You’ll have todo a little exploration of earlier posts.

29
British Bikes / Re: Villiers engine in 1930s Waratah
« Last post by R on July 04, 2025, 12:09:38 AM »
Quote from: 33d6 on July 03, 2025, 02:13:03 PM
That particular Waratah looks very much like the 1938 Excelsior Meritor.

Ahah !
Do we have evidence that this re-decalling of Excelsiors-to-Waratahs was going on prewar also then ?

https://cybermotorcycle.com/gallery/excelsior-1937/images/Excelsior-1937-250cc-G4-Cat.jpg
30
British Bikes / Re: Hot Start Problem
« Last post by R on July 04, 2025, 12:04:20 AM »
It is not entirely clear (to me) what method you are now going to use to set the ignition timing,
but I'd comment that if it is not going to verify that it is sparking at that 3/8" BTDC at full advance,
then we might be back to square one ?

And, the fuzzy logic of "hot gases" escapes me also. If BSA increased the tappet clearance, it is
very likely that they found the valve was growing with heat, until it lost any clearance.
At this point it may/would/could start losing compression - which may make them
a) difficult to restart
b) begin to burn a valve, since the hot gases would/could be continuously escaping.
And this would not be good.
Hopethishelps
Have fun !

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