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41
British Bikes / Re: Troubleshooting a JAP Special
« Last post by cardan on August 09, 2026, 01:45:01 AM »
Worth keeping an eye on the tappet clearance: if it moves more you'd better investigate. If it doesn't move, it's not unusual to see hardened steel caps (think shallow bucket) on top of the valve stems to increase the effective length of the valve. With the rocker arm acting directly on the end of the valve stem it's important that the stem is hard enough to stop it either wearing or mushrooming.

Leon
42
Identify these bikes! / Re: L'il Villiers
« Last post by cardan on August 09, 2026, 12:41:22 AM »
OK: it's weird I know but I have made a study of Excelsior frame lugs. Perhaps not as late as the bike in question, but I think the same ideas apply.

Prior to WW1 the firm of R. Walker & Son were makers and wholesalers of frame lugs and fittings. One of their large customers was Excelsior, which at the time was still attached to its origins as Bayliss Thomas. During the war (1917-ish, I recall), RWS purchased Excelsior and I think their ownership carried on until "the end".

Thus "Excelsior" "made their own lugs and fittings" while RWS sold similar lugs to other makers, in the UK and (especially) the colonies. They offered lug sets for a range of bikes, both in the UK and in Australia. In Adelaide, for example, the lightweight set was used by Elliott Payneham for some of their Villiers-powered bikes while J.N. Taylor used the heavyweight set for their V twins. My 1921 Victor Blackburne, made by Taylor, has stamped on the engine plates: "RW&S 6&8 JAP 8 B". My bike uses the 8hp Blackburne twin, while others (like the bikes built by Taylor for Swastika) use 6 and 8hp JAPs.

Unsurprisingly the Australian bikes share many features with the Excelsiors of the period. When Excelsior went to a whacky enormous steering head castings for their big twins around 1921, the same big lugs appeared on some Australian bikes, like Lou Borgelt's personal Swastika JAP.

The RWS heavyweight gearbox lug (or Australian copies of it) appear widely in Australian bikes in the early 1920s.

The Waratah on sale looks like it has a star dropper welded to the front down tube!!

Leon

Edit: I have only a couple of illustrated adverts for R Walker & Son lugs and frame fittings, from 1919 and 1924, both showing lightweight sets. Because sales were wholesale only, adverts don't appear in the usual magazines. Happy to see more if there are any out there!
43
Identify these bikes! / Re: L'il Villiers
« Last post by 33d6 on August 08, 2026, 07:33:50 AM »
I disagree with the 'reinforcing the weak spots' idea. Why spend money, time and effort shoving reinforcing tubes inside other frame tubes when a more thoughtfully designed headstock lug and fitting decent grease nipples would have prevented the whole issue happening in the first place. Not much chance of that happening in British lightweight world was there. Their whole world seemed to revolve around their race to the bottom of cheap and nasty. Price seemed to be the sole criteria for the majority.

My '39' Montgomery is a perfect example. I never appreciated how a firm could use the one rear axle lug for every machine in its range, from a 125 two-stroke to a 1000cc vee-twin. And make same universal lug right or left handed by bashing off the the various unwanted bits to suit either the left or right side of the frame. Or how one could further cheapen a set of pressed steel forks seemingly identical to those on my Excelsior by not fitting the friction dampers used by Excelsior and eliminating all means of link and spindle adjustment with an anti-rattle Thackery washer on the end of each spindle. I won't go on to mention the centre stand made of angle iron nor the saddle mounting using the same angle iron. In the end its just so nasty you have to love it. Its pure runt of the litter territory.

We do digress. Its a pity we don't have the frame number. I'm curious to know whether this Waratah is one of the mis-war imports or immediate post war.

One final note. Leg shields were a standard fitment on the Excelsior version. They don't show up well on the usual catalogue illustrations but they're there. They were attached to the front down tube by the usual clamp on cross pieces. One look at the carburettor position and you can see why Excelsior fitted them.   
   
44
Identify these bikes! / Re: L'il Villiers
« Last post by R on August 08, 2026, 03:14:00 AM »
It wasn't unknown for the frames on the bigger bangers to break either !
They should really have had a reinforcing tube inside the weak points - but didn't do so.
It was with a sigh of relief that the industry moved to all welded frames mid 50s (mostly).
In fact, postwar Waratah frames had some of the fixtures welded on, rather than lugged.
Half and half, as it were.

Is there a casting number anyplace on that head lug ?
M&B in Walsall (near Birmingham) supplied a number of the big firms.
And maybe more.
I've got the little "Excelsior the Lost Pioneer" booklet, but it doesn't go into the head lug supplier details !
(nor does any other brand I can think of)
But someone might know...
45
Identify these bikes! / Re: L'il Villiers
« Last post by 33d6 on August 08, 2026, 02:22:24 AM »
Its not unknown for the front down tube to break on these wee beasties. My Montgomery frame was broken and brazed up just below the head stem lug when I got it and two of my Excelsior frames have repairs to the top tube immediately behind the head lug. I think its a combination of poor fork lubrication and skimping on the head stem lug plus of course making the whole frame as cheaply as possible.
When the forks stiffen up through lack of grease all the road shocks are transmitted through them to the main frame loop which "lozenges" over big bumps with the top tube bending. This eventually finds the frame loop weak point and it fractures there. Usually either the top tube immediately behind the head lug or the down tube immediately below the head lug. This is why I have a complete fixation about fitting modern 'zerk' grease nipples to girder forks and keeping them well greased. Not only do you get a much improved ride you also get better road holding and give the frame a chance of survival. This is just another one of the little subtleties you learn from riding British lightweights.
 
Given the cost of restoration I think the $600 offered to date is about top dollar for what is on offer.

My only serious question is about the provenance of the offending head stem lug. Was the lug considered part of the forks and provided by the fork maker or was it a separate item sourced by the frame maker? That is, to Excelsiors own design? Anyone know?
46
Identify these bikes! / Re: L'il Villiers
« Last post by murdo on August 07, 2026, 11:27:52 PM »
Looks more like a piece of angle steel welded to the down tube.
47
British Bikes / Re: Troubleshooting a JAP Special
« Last post by Rockburner on August 07, 2026, 08:36:23 PM »
Dull one tonight.

Just cleaning the clutch mostly.

..


Obviously there's still photos! :D

Plates and accoutrements set for some BZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZT


Cleaning the basket in petrol, I also brushed the hub off with petrol



Brass brushing the plates (the BZZZZZZZZZZZT got a lot of the "fresh" oil off I think, but there's still a lot of ancient gunge.


I should point out that these are definitely modern items, they're sintered bronze, like brake pads (which a huge amount of sense if you think about it - brakes and clutches are basically the same thing, just doing opposite jobs)

This is preying on what's left of my mind...


The only way that adjustment can be SOO at the end of it's range is if
a) the push rod has shortened...
b) the valve has shortened...

neither of which seem terribly likely....

or c) the rocker arm has bent!

Or maybe d), the cam follower has bent!

Basically... SOMETHING has got shorter, which is why the valve-clearance opened up... but for it to open up nigh on over a millimetre in 60 miles...

I'm beffuddled.

The basket and hub seem to have cleaned up nicely, I still haven't been able to split the hub out (to check the cush-drive rubbers), but sod it. If they're holding the thing together that hard, they're obviously still pretty solid.


I am slightly concerned though because one of the studs is slightly loose, and I can't see how to tighten it up...

Nice clean accoutrements.


3 Clean plates.... got this far and my hands started to ache,


The rest are separated to let the moisture get trapped


 so giving it a rest for the night.  Have a good weekend all. :)
48
Identify these bikes! / Re: L'il Villiers
« Last post by cardan on August 07, 2026, 12:36:16 AM »
Is it the remains of the leg shields on the down tube?
49
Identify these bikes! / Re: L'il Villiers
« Last post by cardan on August 07, 2026, 12:29:24 AM »
No, unfortunately no reply to my message supplying info on the engine date and asking for another look for the frame number (with extra tips about where to look). Since I'm not a buyer, I don't feel that I can push it.

If you look at the bike, there are a lot of bits missing, and plenty of work to be done on the bits that are there. I worry about the front down tube that looks funny in the photos... Anyway, hope someone enthusiastic buys it! It's wartime origins are interesting.

Leon
50
Identify these bikes! / Re: Miller Waratah headlamp bulbs ?
« Last post by R on August 06, 2026, 10:37:03 PM »
Does anyone know what the corresponding little bracket in the headlamp body looks like. ?
That would secure the rim to the body.

Might be something L shaped ?  And partly go through a smallish slot in the body.
Never having seen one makes it tricky to find or even fabricate one..
Villiers bullet-like unit, about 5 inches or a shade more, with Miller switch on top.

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