T100R

[Marky]

Hi- After  a good few years of pure pleasure on the bike I am attempting a rebuild which  began with kickstart problems.  Now down to the crankshaft bush and found the woodruff key was not locked in(new key needed), the bush was not tight on the shaft(new bush) but more worrying the bush came off without heat which makes me believe the case is worn from the bush turning on the shaft.  Its fits in too loosely and I wondered if its possible to get a slieve put in the case rather than have to now look for a new /old crankcase.  I had thought of locktite but this bush has oil lines and the thought of some locktite either blocking lines or coming loose is not the way I want to go. Has anyone any ideas on this please?

[twolitre]

Presumably you are talking about the timing case bush.
You said the bush "was not tight on the shaft". Nor should it be. It should be a good hand-sliding fit with no perceptible "rock". Too often though the crankshaft end is worn, which will lower oil pressure. That would probably mean a new shaft if they are case-hardened, which I am not sure of, or if not taking the shaft to be machined and a new bush made.
If the shaft is ok it might be possible to tin the outside of a new bush with tinmans solder so that it is a hard push in fit in the casing. Oil slots can be easily scraped out.

[Rex]

You can buy oversize bushes for when the crank is reground. It used to be Triumph standard practice that the two big-ends and the crank nose were all reground at the same time, but things change over time.
Tinning the bush sounds good, but there are some excellent Loctite prodicts now for just this purpose, and there's no reason why the oil 'ole should get plugged when you do it either.

Don't get the woodruff key bit, though. Do you mean the half-moon tab + self-tapper used to secure the bush?

[Duppy Conqueror]

Im helping Marky on this project the is on the timing side and is completly shot. It has been turning in the casing and has caused considerable wear. Marky is refering to the half moon key held in by a self tapper.
Wondering if the casing could be machined and a slieve put in.

[L.A.B.]

Wondering if the casing could be machined and a slieve put in.

I expect that's possible, or maybe an oversize bush could be made up to fit?

You need to find a good engineering shop, preferably somebody who specialises in Triumph or British bike repairs.

You could try:

SEP http://www.sep-kegworth.co.uk/
Or
MRC http://www.motorcyclerestorationcompany.com/

[Duppy Conqueror]

Thanks LAB I have a friend with a small workshop and foundary who makes minature steam engines he offered to do it. I was more wondering if anybody had heard of it being done before. 

[Rex]

Never seen wear that bad I must admit. He could always try Kent Daytonas as he's both a good machinist and knows the Triumph C range.
Doesn't sound a huge problem though.

[Revband]

Not only heard of it being done, I have done it so I expect have lots of others, you will need to ensure that that the bush is slightly smaller than the crankshaft journal after it has been ground, the bush is an interference fit in the case (heat the cases to fit the bush), after fitting the the bush should be line reamed with the case halves bolted together to ensure the hole lines up correctly.

[Duppy Conqueror]

There is a local firm which has done some work for us which  seem to remember  the name name from my biking days but we will follow up the links if we have no joy there.
Just about every bush and bearing in the engine is shot but surprisingly no play in the big end the play is probably being taken up by all the alluminium and bronze from all the other bearings. I think the problems have been caused by the oil pump it, and we havent even looked at the rockers yet which I know were running very dry a year ago because the feeder pipe was blocked but I'm sure that will become a knew thread.

[Duppy Conqueror]

Thanks Rev at the moment no intention of grinding the crank it looks ok but hope to get a micrometer on it tomorrow Just dont want to give Marky more bad knews

[Marky]

Hey Guys -Thanks for all the input-brightened up what was looking like a dark few days!! Will 'solder''on with great help from Duppy and your advice and get more pleasure from the maintenance! Sorry for delay in replying but BT Internet here in NI was down until tonight.Cheers for now.

[Duppy Conqueror]

Ok Loctite has been suggested and will be used to fit the new timing side bush.The crank does need reground goin to get that done and the big ends looked at well its hard ta grind the crank with the conrods flyin round so that should be the bottom end sorted. Apart from that half moon shape retainer which isnt half moon shaped but more rugby ball shaped is held in by a self tapper so worry about loctite bearing fit or self tapper falling out.
On the inside of the bush where the shoulder on it hits against the inside of the crankcase there is slot which looks like it should have slotted into a pin. Did triumph just go cheapskate here
 

[twolitre]

Had a look at the Loctite site. I cannot find anywhere where they mention fitting bushes with their product.
They do "bearing fit" stuff, but I would not think they would envisage the amount of clearance/wear you are talking about. And they are also dealing with ferrous to ferrous components not (probably) phosphor bronze to aluminium alloy. For which it might not be suitable. Contact with engine oil (additives) rather than grease might also be a factor.
I am not a chemist, but mixing different materials and chemicals is chemistry. Which can turn out good or bad!
 There is an advisory link on the website worth checking out.

[Marky]

Hi Folks - thanks for your advice and interest. I have fired off the very same query you highlighted to Loctite and will see what they come up with.  I'm a bit unsure to the degree of ''play'' with this crankshaft bush and how much is accepted.  Opinions and my estimations seem to vary from 'needing a 'hand sliding fit'' which it borders on (in my opinion)- to too loose (Duppy) and the engineering workshop I talk to saying reground shaft, new sized bush with small bit of loctite and turning the half moon over will do the job (in their opinion).  Want to get it right but costs (as always) are mounting!  Next concern is the tappets which show a ''little'' wear across the top and a ''small'' amount of play in the guides!  Any directions on what is acceptable here or not would be usefull so I can get to the bottom of things! Thank You

[Revband]

Hi Marky

"Want to get it right but costs (as always) are mounting!"

Yes I have to agree costs do mount, but, if you get it wrong the cost will be far greater.

This bush is used to not only support the end of the shaft but also feed the oil to the big ends, any loose fit here starves the big ends of oil, the results I think you can guess, if you check with specialized Triumph parts suppliers you may find one with a bush with the centre undersize to fit the ground shaft and the outer oversize to compensate for the worn case, if not get one made, you know it makes sense, do the job right and you only do it once.

As for the tappets I guess the wear you ask about is on the face which runs on the cam, slight wear here is no problem also they should be a fairly loose fit in the guides.