350 cc side valve JAP engine parts needed

[Mobike]

I have recently bought a 350cc side valve JAP engine and require a few parts ,anyone have anything to help me get it up and running?

[33d6]

It's usually helpful if you say what parts you are after. After all, we can see your photo is of the engine actually running.

[Bear640]

It's usually helpful if you say what parts you are after. After all, we can see your photo is of the engine actually running.

I’m glad I wasn’t the only one that noticed it. If the engine is running why do you need parts?

[mini-me]

That stationary engine mag won't help matters, is this one of those 'custom'  things made out of lawn mower bits? I recognise that trumpet exhaust from an ebay ad,

[TGR90B]

He did say he needed parts to get it "up and running". However you're quite right that the parts should be identified.

[Mobike]

Firstly thank you for your replies,hopefully someone has knowledge of these engines ?
I have an interest in "all" things old,especially mechanical!
Currently my house is up for sale and my "new mower" will be another "vintage one"!
Yes,well spotted it was running for about 30 seconds !
Until the oil pump I was fixated on from the first cough,failed to show any oil ! I have since primed both flow pipes from tank to pump,and from pump  to the engine along with the pump sight glass...is it meant to be full or just a trickle?
I have since ran it briefly ,to check "flow ?"but having no idea what the pump output should be ,I have decided to hold off running it and ask for help from hopefully the " more knowledgable  " on here.
In my experience other enthusiasts usually soak up useful information not always freely available elsewhere!
I have tried Google searches with little results,so thought as its a "mower engine"I would try a  mower forum.
At this moment information  is the main thing  I need.a replacement pump possibly.An exhaust nut so I can fit a "proper "down pipe on and I have removed the ridiculous bell mouth exhaust trumpet!
And yes correct on spotting it was on eBay .
I have a 51 AJS 500 m18,a54 BSA B31 350cc,on the road to get my classic bike fix  ,a 1946 c11 (girder forks,rigid rear)250ohv.project (getting close).
I bought this as a bit of fun. i obtained it  for what i felt was "the right price and I have 3 spare ("correct"engines I can put in this frame if not,though I m hopeful if it Can be made to run properly?
The mag was rebuilt a couple of years back,as was the villiers carb.
I would appreciate any help regarding the oil pump ( it appears adjustable ?)is it meant to be just a drip?
Also how to set up the Villiers  carb  correctly,the timing seems to be ok.
It has good compression but I feel it is not set up (carb)
Any helpful input would be appreciated.
Many thanks,David

[chaterlea25]

Hi David,
It looks like a Pilgrim pump ?
Yes, they are adjustable
Unscrew the adjusting wheel at least one full turn from fully clockwise and run the engine to see if there's some action
You could prime the engine by adding about 150ml of oil to the crankcase through the union on top of the crankcase
This will give enough oil to the engine for quite a while
A rough guide to the pump setting is about 8 drops a minute with a slow running engine
"Petes Bikes" advertise Pilgrim pump repairs and parts in Old Bike Mart
IKBA about Villiers carbs
Meetens may have an exhaust nut? or butter up a mate with a lathe

John

[33d6]

So, you don't really want parts so much as information. That makes life a bit easier.
First, the Pilgrim Pump. As well as Chaterleas advice there is plentiful info in the VMCC Library. It's open to non members and you want a copy of the Bob McGrath Pilgrim booklet which will give you chapter and verse.
Second, all Villiers motorcycle carbs are intended solely for two -strokes running on a mixture of petrol and oil and are jetted accordingly. No information exists on adapting them to elderly four stroke engines. You really are on your own there unless you find another tragic who has gone down this path before you. Your sanity requires fitting a more appropriate carb such as an AMAL as on your B31.
Third, the engine itself. Give us the engine number details and we can date it. Even the spares for that matter. Being fitted with the Pilgrim pump shows it has a total loss oiling system so don't let the oil tank get below about a third full.
General J.A.P. info abounds in both the VMCC Library and the NMM bookshop. Lawnmower forums are an obvious point of call as well.
Finally, what is the engine mounted in? What are the cycle parts? A photo would be nice. The deal is we give what help we can. You provide pretty pictures to keep us happy.
Looking forward to the next instalment. Cheers,

[mini-me]

This "bike"  an assemblage of random unrelated  parts, has been on here before sometime back.

There is nothing pretty about it.

[Mobike]

Many thanks to those with" useful information,"as has been mentioned an Amal carb may be the easiest answer !(thanks Chater lea)
I have several so will look up what I have that may be compatible as the engine has inlet stub not flange.
Apparently Villiers owned JAP post WW2 and as far as I  can tell from the sparse information  ?the carb is correct for this engine.
I bought this as it has a nice Bsa c11 plunger frame 1954 (stove enammeled) ,forks,wheels etc in fair order even what chrome is fitted is sound.The four speed gear box selects gears nicely.
The engine is an Industrial unit as denoted by its "I" preceding the engine number I believe 1936 vintage originally fitted to an Atco "deluxe" 20" mower.
It is"as bought by me",I was not responsible for killing any machines or mowers,possibly I may( when I 've had  my fun tinkering )remember that ? even return it back to its roots (c11)
After cleaning the carb and adjusting the oil pump it does (now) run and seems to be moving oil.
Once again ,thanks to those  for your "helpful"assistance ,I will look up on the VMCC website ,as a paying member might as well enjoy the benefits!
Tragic ? Yes some really do need to lighten up!
Happy days

[33d6]

The initial "I" in the engine number identifies the cubic capacity of the cylinder as 350cc. It has nothing to do with "Industrial" The rest of the engine number serves to identify year, type of lubrication, sporting or racing engine, deviations from standard and so on, hence the request for full information. J.A.P. always referred to this sort of engine as "motorcycle type"even though it might be used in a non motor cycle application such as a lawnmower or industrial trolley. A J.A.P industrial engine is a quite different kettle of fish.

J.A.P. fitted as standard an Amal 274/022 R to this era of 350 sidevalve single.

Forum members are always happy to assist if they can but finding out what the person wants can sometimes be like pulling teeth hence a degree of testiness at times..  It's also a two way thing.  We want to get satisfaction out of the transaction as well as the enquirer.  We actually do this for fun, nothing else.

Cheers,

[iansoady]

Fun, you call it?

[Mobike]

Once again thank s very much for your indulgence in my current project!
Nice to know  some have the knowledge and are willing to expand mine and others in the process.
The engine / type no is IY/O 30252/MS I have nt as yet found any other marks and it lacks the usual J.A.P.
Markings,which I took as it being an Industrial engine,I "think" I read somewhere it dates from 1936?
It has exposed tappets which on later engines have a covering plate.
.I happily stand corrected!
As I said previously I have an interest in things mechanical and my late father who was a dedicated motorcycle enthusiast ,had many happy experiences with numerous J.A.P powered machines.
This is what initially sparked my interest in this project...Along with owning Rudges,and many other machines I had never heard of,Alldays and Onions and others that he had the pleasure ( ? )of.
He also tuned and briefly raced a Triumph tiger 1937 at brands and was in one of John Surtees early races at Brands Hatch ,when he too was mounted on a Tiger !
So as you see, my enthusiasm outstrips my means!
My choice if it were an option would be to own an early  Triumph Tiger but being retired on a limited budget,my
" fun"comes in less "exotic"machinery....
By the way, if any better equipped enthusiasts own a lathe and fancy a project ,i m still looking for a nut for the exhaust !
Obviously happy to cover costs : )
Once again many thanks for your help.
David.

[33d6]

Hi David,
You sound like the standard motorcyclist. Working with a small budget and just a few too many bikes for the finances to hand. Nothing unusual there. Join the clan.
Your engine number tells a lot but not all. IY denotes a 350cc sidevalve single of 70 x 90 bore and stroke. J.A.P made a variety of 350 sidevalve singles of varying bore and stroke each with their own identifying letter so don't be surprised if you find another 350 sidevalve with a different identifying letter. For some reason the factory added a Y to some sidevalve ID's but not all I've never seen any explanation for it. Some lists say the Y denotes a twin port head on J.A.P. OHV models but that isn't the case with a side valve engine is it, so I find it a bit of a mystery. The "O" after the / denotes the year. In this case 1938. At first J.A.P. used individual letters from a code word to identify the year of manufacture but were still making engines when they came to the end of it so then used the rest of the alphabet in a nonsense word. Blindingly clear when all written down but complete gibberish otherwise. Anyway, "O" is 1938.
Nothing to say about the actual number. As with common industry practice that is the unique number for that engine. It is what it is.
Finally we come to the suffix letters, those after the number, MS in your case. These denote any minor changes from standard specification but these are legion. To my knowledge no one has ever listed the myriad minor changes from standard that each purchaser required for the particular engine use they had in mind. Yours for example has an unusually bent inlet manifold. Does one of the suffix letters refer to that? Who knows.
The exposed tappets are a nothing. It's just an obsolete practice which J.A.P never bothered to up date on engines used in non-motorcycle applications. They are very good for impressing the natives.
As far as seeking out an enthusiast with a lathe who may be able to assist I'd suggest looking up your local model engineering club. You are far more likely to find a lathe owner there and like as not quite a few ex-motorcyclists as well. They may very well enjoy being sucked into a fun project.
Finally, I like the idea of a 350 sidevalve in a "C" series Beesa. Theoretically it should give you a lot more grunt but be aware that sort of J.A.P engine was built for durability and reliability not power. It was deliberately built as a plodder. Soft cams, low compression, small carb and so on. That said it probably has good potential to see off any C11 you come across once you get it properly sorted. Phil Irving's 'Tuning for Speed' will be compulsory reading. Particularly as you say you have a few spare engines.
Cheers,

[Grunt]

,i m still looking for a nut for the exhaust !

Do you have the dimensions, particularly the thread form.