Advise on my first vintage purchase

[Kit352]

A tidy 500?

https://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C1165473

Leon

If only it had a hand shifter.  I really like the ajs and matchless brands but they seemed to modernize much quicker than others and ditched the hand shifter quite early.  They seem to sell really quickly with the hand shifter, at least the ones I've seen.

[33d6]

I think you should do a bit more research Kit so as to understand why and when various bikes got verious goodies.
Lighting was optional right up until the mid 30's or so and full electric lighting was the most expensive system although the very very cheapest also had it. (Villiers two-strokes.) Early lighting of any form is not very good but can be made so.
Todays style positive stop foot change appeared in the late 20's and was optional until the mid 30's or so. Even then hand change remained on the cheaper or non sporting models in a range. Some buyers preferred hand change.
Some makes stayed with hand change well after the rest of the world had moved on. There is no logic to it all.
Speedos, horns, rear vision mirrors, pillion seats and pillion footrests were also considered accessories for many years hence two bikes of the same make could be wildly different but both be correct. Slowly these things became a legal requirement but the bike factories still classed them as accessories and charged buyers as such.
Some factories went their own way with oddball thread sizes or unusual mechanical arrangements. Douglas and Velocette spring to mind here. All are fun. All have their own peculiar charms. None are dull.
It all depends on what mechanical abilities you bring to the table or have the aptitude to learn. Do not rely on what you have learnt about bikes back to the 70's. That is a handicap, not a plus.
Doing a bit of research first will be beneficial.
Cheers

[Kit352]

Just popped up at Andy's.  I like everything about these 2 bikes other than the small engine sizes.  I'm also assuming the frames are very small.

http://www.andybuysbikes.com/bikeshtml/07352ctn.html#  I really like this one.  Cant find much info on it though.

http://www.andybuysbikes.com/bikeshtml/07351mtg.html  seems very similar to the above one. 

Where is a better place to do research for old bikes like these.  I've only really had good luck at the lars Anderson museum library but that's mostly looking at technical information and maybe some history.  It doesnt really help much with actually determining if it's a good purchase.

[Rex]

That Montgomery has clearly been recently restamped, and as it's not DVLA registered that will be a red flag to the DVLA inspector when he examines it. The Carlton had had a recent makeover too (Red rims? Really?)  and the front mudguard is a poor fit.
Personally I would rather see honest rusty bits and missing mudguards etc than pay a premium for something that's been assembled for resale.

[33d6]

It so happens I’m working on a 1939 Montgomery Terrier at the moment and I can definitely say the frame has been re-stamped. The proper numbers are lightly stamped vertically high up on the right hand side of the front down tube. You have to do a fair amount of cleaning to find it.
They are not a replica of the engine number which is correct.
The engine number of the Carlton shows it to be a post war production between 1946-48. I haven’t yet looked up what it was originally fitted to. It is far more of a lash up than the Montgomery which really is as cheap and nasty as it looks.
Both are powered by the 9D Villiers and there are various sneakiest about them that you need to know about them to get the best out of them. You are too big and heavy to get any sort of performance.

[iansoady]

You also need to ask yourself why you actually want a hand gear change? They can be a bit intimidating especially when you need to change down for a roundabout etc and find you need 3 hands working in synchronisation. Of course if it's merely because you like the look of them I'll shut up.

I liked the Sunbeam I referred to above but to be fair, although its performance was quite sparkling the brakes were poor and the hand change made every trip more challenging than it needed to be. Living in suburban Brum meant I had several miles of busy roads, junctions, traffic lights etc before I could give it its head which was somewhat tiresome. A later bike with foot change and working brakes like my Norton ES2 is a much more useable proposition.

Oh and I just wouldn't bother looking at 2 strokes. You could get a perfectly serviceable just post-war AMC 350/500 for £4,000 or so. That would give you decent performance with relative ease of riding.

[mini-me]

He's in the USA, where the museum library he refers to is.

you are all being taken for a ride chaps.

[Kit352]

My reasoning for the hand shift is pure nostalgia.  I've always wanted one on my Harley but couldnt do it.  If I am going to go old school I'm going to do it right.  Hand shift in my opinion is one of the things that makes these old bikes great.  It's really the only thing I wont budge on.  I would prefer a tank mount unit vs the side saddle one but I think either one is fine.

[Kit352]

He's in the USA, where the museum library he refers to is.

you are all being taken for a ride chaps.

This is getting old with you.  First I'm French because I like French bikes now I live in America because I have visited an American museum several times.  You really need to ask questions before blindly accusing with absurd and quite frankly nonsensical guesses.  I dont know what's wrong with you but you really need to stop.  Everything with you is all accusations or false information.  I thought you were blocking me?  Please do so.  People are allowed to travel and like foreign things.  Your life must be so sad to act like this and for that I pity you.

[TGR90B]

So you're not French or a Yank. That narrows it down a bit. I know one thing for sure, you're a keyboard warrior or serial poster; whatever the term is.

[mini-me]

 Can't see  it, What did he say then?

Would I accuse him of being French? Did I? Nah,French have more sense that to buy such tat thats why they send it here for mugs.

Hand shifter? no brit uses that term, and mostly know how to spell advice, well on this side of the pond anyway.

[iansoady]

He could of course mean "please advise me". But I agree this thread has run its course.

[mini-me]

It should never have got this far. I have known lots of this kind, both on the net and in my days in the trade, they used go round bike shops wasting time asking questions for the sake of it.

But what really gets me about them is that people give them so much of their time and knowledge in a genuine effort to encourage  them but not really realising what these idiots are up to. Notice how when this guy gets a response to a question, he'll evade the content of the answer and go off on another tack.
Read it all, he's a big hefty bloke,allegedly, yet he keeps on coming up with piddling little two strokes to consider, answer all that he come back with another prospect.  Not once has he selected the sort of bike he specified in the OP.
He's using Tiernans stock list, isn't there enough choice there? why not ask Tiernan the seller these questions? Because he don't really want a bike.

He pisses off people who will stop bothering to try to help genuine newcomers.That's my real grief here.
Like 99%of the blokes who take the time to answer him I'm happy to give advice, experience free of charge, pissed off getting my goodwill abused.

Next poster who comes on here with some shagged out foriegn 2 stoke, and we've had a few, I promise I'll ignore him.
 

[TGR90B]

Your point about changing tack has hit the nail on the head mini-me. You see it on so many trouble shooting posts and it's a dead giveaway IMO.

[mini-me]

Can we discuss brexit instead?