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Messages - cardan

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British Bikes / Re: Nut Sizes
« on: December 04, 2018, 08:46:50 AM »
FN used a lot of existing gun fitting threads.....for instance the 1/4" x 22 thread is from the two triggerguard screws of the 1889 Mauser rifle that FN was set up to make.

Thanks John - I hadn't heard the story about the machinery before. The various histories of FN are pretty quiet about what happened in Liege during the two wars...

The 3/16 thread used by FN is 3/16-30, still used to secure the grip on a pistol!



British Bikes / Re: Nut Sizes
« on: December 04, 2018, 03:58:46 AM »
Sigh - sometimes it isn't easy!

: imperial (labelled AF, where 7/8"AF means 7/8" across the flats.

If a spanner was labelled 7/8 AF it would be for a Unified (SAE) threadform, not Imperial, and unless the OP had a post 1968 Triumph, BSA or early H-D it wouldn't fit the fasteners.

Well, not really. Hexagon sizes and threads are very often unrelated. Believe it or not, pre-WW1 Belgium-built FN motorcycles used all their own threads - unlike anything else but of imperial diameters (1/4-22, 5/16-20, 3/8-18 and other weird things), with imperial hexagons (7/16"AF, 1/2"AF etc.)

I have an Australian-made motorcycle and most of the fasteners have BSW threads, but with imperial hexagons.

As I noted above, AF just means "across flats" and does not make any comment on the thread to be found on the fastener.

It's all good fun!


British Bikes / Re: Nut Sizes
« on: December 03, 2018, 09:12:38 PM »
Sigh - sometimes it isn't easy!

The only difference between "old" and "new" whitworth hexagons is that the early ones have one size larger hexagon. i.e. an old (say pre WW1) 1/2 W nut has the same size hex (0.920" AF - across flats) as a post WW2 9/16 W nut. Spanners and sockets are often labelled 1/2W-9/16BS to reflect this.

Thus "whitworth" tools fit old or new "whitworth" hexagons.

More-or-less there are only three options for hexagons, which are always measured AF (across the flats): imperial (labelled AF, where 7/8"AF means 7/8" across the flats. Similarly metric is measured AF, so 21mm is 21 mm across the flats.

Only Whitworth/British Standard have "silly" AF measurements, which can be googled.

(I'm not going to mention BA hexagons! Luckily these are small, and not used on axles.)

Good luck!


Identify these bikes! / Re: Does anyone know what kind of bike this is?
« on: November 22, 2018, 10:23:09 PM »
Mustang perhaps?


Worth posting a photo of a Mustang brochure from the above site. Very entertaining!

British Bikes / Re: 1920s cone hubs
« on: October 22, 2018, 03:48:57 AM »
British axles are usually cycle thread - either 26 or 20 tpi - try Nooky's Nuts either online or on ebay. Note that 20 tpi UNF nuts can be forced onto a 20 tpi BScy axle, but don't do it. Best to measure the thread first, as some axles have unusual threads - often 24 tpi.


British Bikes / Re: 1920s cone hubs
« on: October 21, 2018, 07:20:11 AM »

Lots of hubs - even good quality ones - from the early 1920s didn't use locknuts. I've done thousands of miles on bikes without them, with no problem.



British Bikes / Re: Anyone into Scotts here
« on: October 07, 2018, 10:51:12 PM »

Many years of fun and anguish for the purchaser of any of the three lots! Great to see such good quality "junk" is still around.

I assume the BMW will attract quite a crowd - OHV and I suppose pre-war?


British Bikes / Re: Please Identify Bike
« on: August 29, 2018, 09:11:11 AM »

Hi Ung,

Nice one. The bike is an early 1920s P&M (Phelon and Moore), the forerunner to the famous "Panther".

In 1921 (or so) they tried a disastrous motor with fins parallel to the ground, so I suspect this one is 1922-23. Possibly with a 4-speed gearbox rather than the earlier 2-speed-primary-chain setup. Google will provide many photos for comparison.

The bike was a few years old by 1930, which explains the non-standard paint scheme.




I hadn't realised there was a WD version of the the RE 250, but there's a nice discussion here from 11 years ago...



Given the issue date of the rego, I assume we're at the other end of the 1930s, so something like a 1939 Model D (250). As 33d6 says, engine and frame numbers would enable a proper id.


The Classic Biker Bar / Re: Manx Norton
« on: August 19, 2018, 11:33:41 PM »

Truly amazing! I wonder if Tony was just around the corner...

Here he is on his Manx in 1961, from



I wonder if it's worth LESS after its restoration? A bike is only original once.


The Classic Biker Bar / Re: Manx Norton
« on: August 19, 2018, 04:54:09 AM »

Hi Hughie,

It's interesting to consider the best ways to find information.

First, it helps to ask for what you want: so you're not "looking to find out all I can about a bike racer called tony godfrey who raced a Manx in the iom" but instead you'd like to contact someone who knows him? Fair enough. Sorry I don't know him. I live in Australia and don't know too many of the 65-odd million residents of the UK.

But here's the real suggestion: Tell us what you know about him. Tell us why you want to know more. Post some photos. Give us some hints. Get us interested.

You never know, people can sometimes help in unexpected ways (maybe someone lived around the corner from Tony Godfrey in Bitterne, Southampton in 1962), but in the absence of an interesting story don't expect too much.



Identify these bikes! / Re: Great Uncle Ben's 1920's bike...any ideas?
« on: August 17, 2018, 10:35:06 AM »
Did Calthorpe supply engines to other makers ?

I don't think so.


The Classic Biker Bar / Re: Manx Norton
« on: August 17, 2018, 05:04:54 AM »

A long and successful career by the look of it. In addition to Norton he rode Velocette, Matchless, AJS, EMC, Yamaha, Villiers, Kawasaki, Coleshill Seeley, Aermacchi, and Goddard Bultaco at various TT or Manx Grand Prix events between 1956 and 1972. There should be no shortage of information out there.

Good luck.


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