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British Bikes / Re: Villiers engine in 1930s Waratah
« Last post by R on July 04, 2025, 11:29:22 PM »
My little Waratah 125 was bought from the original owner - decals still (mostly) visible.
He bought it from Williams Bros in Wentworth Ave in Sydney with his army demob pay.
And then rode it the 400 odd miles out to Hillston.
Think he said it took 2 days, but not sure on that.
At 30 mph, thats 13 hours !
Used all his petrol rationing coupons (4 ?) to do it.

Surviving bikes show differences in those toolboxes also, so its not just brochure creep ?

P.S. Tom Byrne in Wentworth Ave was the Excelsior Dealer then. 
About 100 yards up the hill from P & R Williams.
From advertising, the Excelsior was either 5 or 15 shillings dearer.
Byrnes did Triumphs also, and went on to become the main BMW Dealer.

Powerhouse Museums example
Their thick gold pinstripe is different to my thin gold twin pinstripes.
Maybe someone got it wrong ?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waratah_motorcycles#/media/File:1948waratahmotorcycle.jpg


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British Bikes / Re: Villiers engine in 1930s Waratah
« Last post by 33d6 on July 04, 2025, 02:14:17 PM »
Given that we know catalogue illustrations of any make can have errors and makers were not unknown to send the odd NQR (Not Quite Right) model out here. I can never get too excited about minor  differences.

Personally I go along with Cardans “commercial pragmatism”, with Excelsior juggling the demands of the Australian Excelsior agent (whoever they were) plus William Bros Waratah plus using up as much redundant stock cheaply as possible as they could get away with. We’ll never know all the minor differences and does it really matter?

As for the myriad of differences between the various Villiers 250’s I'm not surprised at the odd publication getting them tangled up. I do the same. With the massive amount of wordage generated about them all a serious reader knows better than taking all these reports at literal face value. There’s bound to be a certain percentage of mistakes.

Do we need to know more or do we know enough?
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British Bikes / Re: Finding neutral
« Last post by rgsjohn on July 04, 2025, 11:42:41 AM »
I have literally spent hours, and hours adjusting my clutch (A10) to no avail. I have checked the plates for burrs and flatness, fitted new springs, and fitted an SRM pressure plate with the radial bearing on the push rod. I set the the pressure plate with a clock gauge to ensure that it was lifting absolutely squarely. none of this has made much difference to its operation. The clutch operates fairly well when its cold but as it warms up the gear change becomes increasingly notchy and neutral more difficult to select. I have just given up on it because I don't know where else to go. I have learned to live with it. Sometimes you get lucky, sometimes you don't. Sorry this is not much help to you, but this is my personal experience. The clutch is a 4 spring clutch by the way. Always when cold first gear engages positively and smoothly with just a click no crunching or difficulty in engaging. A perfection action until it warms up then neutral becomes hard to find and first engages with a clunk. The A10 clutch is an enigma. Some seem to function well, others not so much.
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British Bikes / Re: Villiers engine in 1930s Waratah
« Last post by cardan on July 04, 2025, 08:14:02 AM »
I don't know how to differentiate them! So far as I know even the frame numbers were similar, but I only have a handful to study. Best to have provenance of a bike with Waratah on the tank, known original owner, original registration or whatever.

It wouldn't surprise me if there was a little bit of "old stock" syndrome, with slightly out of date bikes or older, lower cost parts fitted to the bikes to be sent out. But it was all about commercial pragmatism: Williams Bros were a big (huge, in the automobile trade) and well-established firm, importing and selling quite a number of Waratahs, so clearly they wouldn't be accepting or selling old junk.

My working hypothesis is that Waratahs were built in the UK by Excelsior (from 1930-on) and shipped to Williams Bros in Sydney.
 
Leon
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British Bikes / Re: Hot Start Problem
« Last post by cardan on July 04, 2025, 07:57:11 AM »
Just how do you "set the timing by moving the magneto gears"  ??
Or is that the time honoured method of tapping the gearwheel onto the taper, and then locking it with the nut ...
Whatever... within half a tooth would be enormously better than it is now.
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British Bikes / Re: Villiers engine in 1930s Waratah
« Last post by R on July 04, 2025, 07:29:23 AM »
And, we note the difference in toolbox between the Meritor and the 'tah 250.
I've also noticed this between my 125 and the Excelsior.

To differentiate them ?
Local manufacture maybe ?
Some were cheaper ??
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British Bikes / Re: Finding neutral
« Last post by R on July 04, 2025, 07:26:21 AM »
Are you clicking it into neutral in the last little bit while rolling to a stop.
And from 2nd, or 1st
Or attempting it once stopped.

Neutral (deliberately) has a lesser notch to it, to prevent the 1st to 2nd shift from hanging up.
It can be a very finicky adjustment of the clutch to get this action just right.

Whomever rebuilt it could have improved/changed/altered this ?
Changing the gearbox oil can sometimes work wonders with the action too.
Ain't old bikes fun !
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British Bikes / Finding neutral
« Last post by Mikey82 on July 04, 2025, 07:04:18 AM »
I have recently acquired a 1963 Golden Flash, which was completely rebuilt in 1985
I have taken bike for its maiden run and found problems finding neutral.
I have double checked settings for the clutch cable and reset but still difficult getting into neutral especially when engine hot.
It has a new clutch and my next task is to strip clutch and check plates and springs.
Anything else I should check for, whilst in there?
Thanks in advance
Mike
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British Bikes / Re: Villiers engine in 1930s Waratah
« Last post by R on July 04, 2025, 06:08:35 AM »
Do we have an example of a Waratah that is not an exact Excelsior model ?

I must have skipped class that day. Or my memory has slipped a cog.
And I saved all posts under W
Inc some from elsewheres .....
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British Bikes / Re: Hot Start Problem
« Last post by R on July 04, 2025, 06:02:28 AM »
No wonder the factory was getting back lotsa bikes with faulty running !
Sounds diabolical.

Just how do you "set the timing by moving the magneto gears"  ??
Or is that the time honoured method of tapping the gearwheel onto the taper, and then locking it with the nut ...
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